prev <-> next
[2011-01-04 15:56:33] - haha oops. ~a
[2011-01-04 15:55:26] - a: saturday works but isn't it mean to schedule something that conflicts with dewey's charity thing? - aaron
[2011-01-04 15:06:48] - mig: so, then, it works! right? ~a
[2011-01-04 14:59:56] - neither saturday nor sunday work for me. - mig
[2011-01-04 14:59:04] - does saturday at 1500 work? ~a
[2011-01-04 14:58:14] - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kAG39jKi0lI -- Xpovos
[2011-01-04 14:56:40] - a: Is there ultimate this weekend? -Paul
[2011-01-04 13:22:33] - paul: good question. this is something i probably should look into some time (though i'll probably just look at what the ubuntu software center has to offer). ~a
[2011-01-04 13:20:52] - aaron: Does that differ from "launching slaves heedlessly"? -- Xpovos
[2011-01-04 13:17:09] - http://thehairpin.com/2011/01/women-laughing-alone-with-salad/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed:+thehairpin/BdYj+(The+Hairpin) women laughing alone... with salad - aaron
[2011-01-04 13:16:40] - i was browsing around costco's website and there's a "funeral" section on their online ordering. Disturbing. - mig
[2011-01-04 12:56:07] - speaking of which, "launching slaves headlessly" --- easily one of the most disturbing mental images i've encountered from technical jargon - aaron
[2011-01-04 12:22:00] - Daniel: Well, it's self-invested through Scottrade. I haven't been able to find that information there either. -Paul
[2011-01-04 12:13:11] - http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/Video-Awful-spot-helps-7-9-Seahawks-win-NFC-Wes?urn=nfl-302772 paul and I were discussing this last night, one of the most bizarre nfl officiating gaffes I may have ever witnessed. - mig
[2011-01-04 12:03:53] - a: ahahaha i needed more context so i went back to look at the convo. there was a funny related comic called "isometric", which showed the villain in that movie launching hostages at the good guys with a "hostage-pult" - aaron
[2011-01-04 11:29:55] - Paul: I'm not sure I could track that percentage over time though. Just the % difference currently. -Daniel
[2011-01-04 11:29:21] - is your IRA through a company or bank? I have an IRA with Vanguard and I know that somewhere on there I could see the % difference between current value and amount deposited but it wasn't super simple to do it. -Daniel
[2011-01-04 10:29:57] - I can't figure out a way in google finance to not have it count contributions as appreciation (meaning when I deposit money into my IRA, it counts as a sudden ~10% jump in my portfolio) and I also can't figure out how to get it to count dividends in my portfolio performance (which is important as I am investing in a lot of dividend heavy stocks now). -Paul
[2011-01-04 10:28:02] - Does anybody here use any websites or free online software to track the performance of their portfolio vs the market? I've been managing my IRA myself and am interested in comparing it my 401(k) (which is invested in mutual funds) and the market in general, but I can't find any good resources to use. -Paul
[2011-01-04 09:36:25] -
the sub-message is dave's reaction to aaron describing the movie swordfish. ~a[2011-01-03 17:48:48] - yes for the most part. The Mar Sara missions limit your upgrades and units, for example. - mig
[2011-01-03 17:03:53] - xpovos: yes your unlocks are available when you replay. - aaron
[2011-01-03 16:55:18] - mig: When you replay, are the armory unlocks you've purchased available for the replay, or do you play it in the same state as your initial play-through? -- Xpovos
[2011-01-03 16:25:58] - paul: the bridge has the archives, but that just lets you play some of the missions you've completed already. - mig
[2011-01-03 15:32:40] - a: Well, if we had been able to repel their assault, I think we would've stood a good chance of mustering a counter-attack to take out one of their colonies. Hard to say, though. -Paul
[2011-01-03 15:31:42] - Isn't there something on the Bridge to view replays? I know you can replay missions there, but I thought there was someplace else to view replays as well. -Paul
[2011-01-03 15:09:51] - xpovos: I don't think so. There is a category for "campaign" replays on the replay tab, but I've yet to find out if anything gets saved there. - mig
[2011-01-03 15:08:09] - Are there replays available of the campaign eps, or just MP? -- Xpovos
[2011-01-03 15:00:42] - agreed. the five early hatcheries were bound to win in the long run . . . i agree we could have turned things around in the short run though. ~a
[2011-01-03 14:56:09] - a: Well, I was watching our incomes and army sizes and we were comparable in income, I think, until I lost my gold expansion, and our army size was larger until the moment I described (our attack on their colony went really well). -Paul
[2011-01-03 14:49:28] - paul: HAHA i just watched that replay . . . i don't watch replays too often. yeah, i was thinking part of the "tide turning" happened earlier when our opponent had five hatcheries before our first meager attack. and way before i even considered an expansion. ~a
[2011-01-03 14:35:56] - Paul: It happens to me too. Fairly randomly. Usually not a huge inconvenience because I'm not at home or it comes back so quickly and without any effort, but it definitely causes me concern about reliability. I'd never try to host even a minor website like this. -- Xpovos
[2011-01-03 14:33:26] - Stephen: Wow, you lose internet for minutes at a time? That's pretty bad.
-Paul[2011-01-03 14:32:59] - a: Also, I checked out the replay of our game, and we were actually winning up until they attacked my gold expansion. Somehow your stalkers got separated from the main army and picked off without killing much in return. That turned the tide. -Paul
[2011-01-03 14:31:18] - a: It was so annoying, because I came so close to winning a few. I expertly broke up an attempt to bunker me in my base but screwed up my roach attack which followed it up. In another, my opponent went heavy roaches and killed me right as I was getting my first mutalisks out. -Paul
[2011-01-03 14:29:50] - a: Nice! It took me about 6 tries, but I finally won a game last night too. -Paul
[2011-01-03 14:26:22] - Paul: I have Comcrap as well, and sometimes I lose internet for minutes at a time, but skipping? Not so much. - Stephen
[2011-01-03 14:22:47] - paul: yay i won a game! it was a kick ass game too. in one game i got to make and very successfully use dt's, collusi, immortals, and blinking stalkers. i hardly ever make dt's but my teammate suggested them at just the right time. and for some reason the opponents never came back with detectors so they were very affective against a few huge armies. ~a
[2011-01-03 14:03:12] - I dislike the pdf format. But I have to give it props here. A 4100+ page document I'm using for work generated from a Crystal report into pdf is a mere 7 and change megabytes. That's pretty efficient. -- Xpovos
[2011-01-03 13:49:52] - Paul: I have comcast, but my phone is verizon and thats where I noticed the hiccups. -Daniel
[2011-01-03 13:38:33] - a: As I understand throttling, you wouldn't be able to recognize if it was happening and would blame it on something else. Probably safest to assume you were being throttled.
-Paul[2011-01-03 13:35:13] - a: I guess the key questions are if you have Comcast and Daniel/Aaron/Stephen don't, and if you were having these problems before the FCC passed their net neutrality rules. -Paul
[2011-01-03 13:33:19] - but, thanks, regardless. ~a
[2011-01-03 13:33:07] - haha, i doubt it's actually throttling. watching the network graph showed a line that seems very inconsistent with my understanding of throttling. ~a
[2011-01-03 13:13:30] - a: We had Pandora running almost all day on Saturday for my family's visit. Katie is a pandora member as well. I didn't notice a single hiccup in the service at any point. We're also on Comcast, though, so I dunno if this helps or harms your throttling thought. I don't know what the quality is set to. -- Xpovos
[2011-01-03 13:07:07] - paul: haha, i missed your message. it looks like we were thinking along the same lines. ~a
[2011-01-03 12:57:27] - well it was just for like a one week period (last week of 2010?) . . . it seems to be better now. ~a
[2011-01-03 12:48:16] - a: It doesn't tell me I have a slow connection though. I also have it set to high quality and I am a pandora member. -Daniel
[2011-01-03 12:47:42] - a: I've had my pandora skip some on my phone when listening but I always blamed it on being a wireless mobile network. Its never skipped for any long amount of time though just a couple of hiccups. -Daniel
[2011-01-03 12:45:52] - nah, i'm a pandora member too (you guys encouraged me to get on the band-wagon). maybe it's throttling from comcast? eh heh. ~a
[2011-01-03 09:56:34] - Happy Belated New Year. ~gurkie
[2011-01-03 09:39:31] - a: no, pandora is in good shape. i listen to it on my cell phone, on my computer, and on my TV and all three play fine. also, i'm on the "high quality mode" which uses more bandwidth. i'm a pandora one member, it's possible they give me some kind of priority. - aaron
[2011-01-03 09:26:57] - Stephen: Sorry, looks like we aren't getting enough people anyway. -Paul
[2011-01-03 09:24:39] - a: Further proof that Comcast is throttling your internet.
-Paul[2011-01-03 08:26:06] - Diplomacy people: I think I'm going to pass on another game. Hopefully you all weren't planning on starting one today or something. - Stephen
[2011-01-03 08:25:19] - a: Pandora doesn't skip for me. - Stephen
[2010-12-31 14:15:56] - aaron (and others): has pandora been skipping for you? pandora says i have a slow internet connection, which i don't. it has only been pandora that i've been having a slow connection with. ~a
[2010-12-30 16:16:35] - http://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/etd1f/amazing_starcraft_cake/ these two cakes (and the related comments) made me smile - aaron
[2010-12-29 16:21:53] - aaron: Sounds like a cool feature. So I went to go look at some YouTube videos of it. Nifty. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-29 16:00:05] - so you'll see like 80 super meat boys run through the level, which gradually get thinned down to 3 or 4, and finally the 1 guy who who makes it into the exit. i thought the replay thing was frivolous at first but now it's one of my favorite parts of the game - aaron
[2010-12-29 15:58:21] - daniel: yeah it's really solid, i played through about two "worlds" the first night i got it, it's really addictive and challenging. but they're nice about giving you infinite lives so i didn't find it frustrating. also, when you beat a level, it shows a replay with all of your attempts simulatneously which looks really cool if it was a hard level - aaron
[2010-12-29 15:47:54] - Aaron: like it so far? A lot of people on reddit had positive things to say but I was trying to wait for it to be part of a pack before buying but I might get that near the end if it doesn't end up in a pack. -Daniel
[2010-12-29 15:32:33] - daniel: i got super meat boy for like $4 - aaron
[2010-12-29 14:45:42] - Anyone else been purchasing things from Steam during their sale? -Daniel
[2010-12-29 14:09:47] - Daniel: You win. Although I do feel more normal now. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-29 14:05:07] - Xpovos: I think its worse that I didn't get it even after you talked about snow until I went and clicked on the link and saw the picture of snow. Blizzard + retailers makes me think of the company not the weather. -Daniel
[2010-12-29 13:35:17] - So... it's probably a bad sign that when the headline on Google Finance today was "$1 billion: Blizzard's cost to retailers" my first thoughts were about how other video game makers were upset with Starcraft 2 blowing them out of the water, and not of the actual snow that fell? Or is that normal? -- Xpovos
[2010-12-28 14:48:33] - How about the accessibility of MRIs here relative to Europe? I am posting this on my phone and can't provide a source for it, though. -Paul
[2010-12-28 13:50:38] - Asks and answers pretty much the same questions we have here with essentially the same answers. Our health care system needs improvement, but the top-end, and reactive care are better than any other. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-28 13:43:18] - source(pdf) -- Xpovos
[2010-12-28 13:40:44] - aaron: That's fundamentally correct. Our doctors are smarter. Theirs are stupider. That's partially because their doctors pay is capped by government intervention, meaning fewer really smart people go into medicine. But it does keep costs down. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-28 13:40:44] - "that doesn't mean our medical technicians and techniques, when used, aren't the best" i think that's the part he's trying to source. i don't see anything on the google either. ~a
[2010-12-28 13:39:24] - pierce: It's all about definition of terms then. Yes, our top end is tops. Our middle is mediocre to bad. And our low is quite literally non-existent. Average that and it probably is middling. But that doesn't mean our medical technicians and techniques, when used, aren't the best. They're also the most expensive. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-28 13:37:24] - aaron: life goes by pretty fast. if you don't stop and look around once in a while, and do whatever you want all the time, you can miss it. ~a
[2010-12-28 12:43:20] - Xpovos: cite for u.s. medicine being best in the world? My understanding was that our best medicine is best in the world, but u.s. medicine taken as a whole is middling compared to other developed countries. - pierce
[2010-12-28 12:33:15] - xpovos: and i guess we need to repeal some things around like, malpractice suits and stuff so those stupider doctors can make a living killing poor people - as long as they're not killing too many poor people - aaron
[2010-12-28 12:32:01] - xpovos: oh!! yeah we just need stupider doctors and cheaper instruments right? is that what france has? - aaron
[2010-12-28 11:00:56] - aaron: But in case I misread your question: it's a combination. They spend a lot less on bottle rockets, but they also spend a lot less on medical treatments. U.S. medical treatment is the best in the world. Ergo it's also the most expensive, so some people can't afford it. Theirs are not as good and less expensive... and cover everyone. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-27 22:14:27] - aaron: Ask France and Spain, they have absurdly high unemployment and even more generous social nets. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-27 19:07:29] - and i think germans are insane because they all act like members of rammstein and make fequent use of the baby hatch. ~a
[2010-12-27 18:16:20] - i guess maybe their health insurance/medical facilities are less wasteful, or maybe they spend less money on bottle rockets - aaron
[2010-12-27 18:15:01] - i wonder how other countries like germany with a stronger "social safety net" could possibly cope with 20% unemployment? how is that sustainable? i don't understand - aaron
[2010-12-27 18:11:35] - http://www.alternet.org/module/printversion/149324 "why germans think we're insane" - an article comparing america to germany for things like vacation, medical insurance, jobless benefits - aaron
[2010-12-27 16:59:53] - the paranoid part of me wonders if the social conservatist aspect of the tea party isn't just a way of killing the movement from the inside... tying it to something controversial to prevent it from gaining bipartisan appeal - aaron
[2010-12-27 16:51:27] - i would find it less confusing if the tea party stayed focused on fiscal conservatism and if they straddled party lines a little better - aaron
[2010-12-27 16:50:38] - mig: ". Tea-partyers surveyed by Cato split down the middle between social conservatives and social liberals, making half of them traditional Republicans and half libertarians." yeah that's one of the things i find most confusing - aaron
[2010-12-27 16:07:25] - http://nymag.com/news/politics/70282/ the article in question. - mig
[2010-12-27 15:16:39] - xpovos: I thought the article as a whole was just weird. I was trying to make sense of the title and the actual content, and it didn't make sense until I got about to the end of it. - mig
[2010-12-27 13:58:08] - mig: Yeah, just came across it. I enjoyed it, actually. Even if he's attacking my values and my culture, I was entertained by it. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-27 13:47:54] - xpovos: you read that ny mag article too, i take it. - mig
[2010-12-27 13:31:52] - "Libertarianism gets caricatured as the weird, Magic-card-collecting, twelve-sided-die-wielding outcast of American political philosophy." Clearly he meant 20-sided-die. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-27 13:27:34] - a: Changed my politics. Because I hadn't selected one of the pre-selected buckets, it dumped me into one. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-27 13:22:29] - altered it how? ~a
[2010-12-27 13:12:13] - Fun fact, Facebook just (in the sense that I just noticed it, no idea how long ago it occurred) altered my profile without my knowledge. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-27 12:58:28] - a: I can understand that. It's a little creepy. In many ways all of Facebook is a little creepy. I frequently find myself regretting signing up for an account. And yet I use it anyway. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-27 12:46:43] - i don't use the facebook friend finder. ~a
[2010-12-27 12:26:00] - This is pretty nifty. http://www.doctoroctoroc.com/8BitJesus/ Try Carol of the Belmonts. It just flows perfectly as either a chiptuned version of Carol of the Bells or Castlevania music. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-27 11:43:41] - mine is the one I use for gmail. alternatively you can use the facebook friend finder, i'm sure most of us will show up on that. - mig
[2010-12-27 11:02:11] - mig: I haven't played WoW in... 3.5 years? So that wouldn't have done it for me. It's entirely possible I missed the real ID phase, but I have no idea. With limited mucking about I couldn't find anyone on a friends list, so I'll assume for now that it didn't work. Which e-mail addy did you use? Mine's my yahoo account. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-27 10:53:53] - xpovos: they did reset the friends list several times. During the last phase, however, the real ID friends was actually live (it was functioning in wow), so any people friended during that time should still be there. - mig
[2010-12-27 10:52:02] - mig: I friended several times during the beta, several times my friends list was reset. So I'm pretty sure that didn't work. Particularly since there was no indication once I had the full game installed that anyone was around. Might have something to do with how late I got to the beta? -- Xpovos
[2010-12-27 10:50:42] - xpovos: at least if you are using the same battle.net account you were in the beta, otherwise, just send a request to me. - mig
[2010-12-27 10:18:21] - xpovos: if you friended us in the beta during the last phase I believe we should already be friended. - mig
[2010-12-26 20:24:20] - Oh, in case it wasn't mentioned, I did get the collector's edition. I don't think it matters for SC2 purposes, but damn, it is sexy. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-26 20:22:40] - a: I need to install first. The weekend has been fairly busy. Installing now. I'll know more about schedule in a week or so, I figure. First step will be to 'friend' y'all, I think. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-26 01:28:18] - title: when do you usually play? i'd like to sync up our schedules since i'm not on 24/7 anymore. ~a
[2010-12-23 16:03:18] - Now, those are more U.S.-based examples, but Britain exports services too. Just not as much as we do. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-23 14:46:59] - mig: The biggest 'error' I spotted or caveat I had was with respect to the non-export of service goods. We do export service goods too. E.g.: Education, our college educational system is a major export; Hollywood, our movies and culture are major exports too. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-23 13:27:54] - a: same, it comes up on "they might be giants radio" every once in awhile! it's by johnathan coulton who has a lot in common with TMBG - aaron
[2010-12-23 13:25:01] - haha! "still alive" just came up on pandora (it's the song by glados from portal).
~a[2010-12-23 13:22:17] - a: fine, fine, 375. Sorry I don't check your changelogs. - mig
[2010-12-23 13:17:21] - 375
~a[2010-12-23 13:07:56] - xpovos: now i'm curious, what are your caveats, or are they too long to explain in 250 character snippets? - mig
[2010-12-23 13:06:49] - Now of course, you can make the argument that if the government demand didn't exist then some of these private entities wouldn't even exist. And you'd probably be right. - mig
[2010-12-23 13:05:23] - I guess the way we view it comes down to how we view the UPS/Fed-Ex taking over the post office hypothetical. - mig
[2010-12-23 13:03:52] - something the government wants to essentially lead to the "public sector has created wealth". - mig
[2010-12-23 13:03:34] - a: anyways, I guess I tend to define public sector as basically work or entities that are directly linked to the government (like being officially a federal employee). Contract work makes the line between public and private sectors a little murkier, but ultimately the way I see it, I'm not in total agreement (at least for the moment) that contractors meeting demand for
[2010-12-23 12:55:14] - a: it definitely borders on bizzar-o. - mig
[2010-12-23 11:14:53] - huh? i think it's more than unintuitive. they aren't called social conservatives for nothing. ~a
[2010-12-23 11:08:03] - mig: cool, yeah i mean it's unintuitive but - i guess there's nothing particularly christian about anti-marijuana laws is there? other than they feel "intuitively christian" because they involve parents yelling at their children and people having no fun - aaron
[2010-12-23 11:00:54] - Hell hath officially frozen over. - mig
[2010-12-23 10:57:25] - a: i read that! i thought that was fantastic. i wonder how long until we can find placebos at CVS - aaron
[2010-12-23 10:44:46] - placebos work, even when patients are told that they are taking placebos? ~a
[2010-12-23 10:38:55] - mig: short version: yes. long version: we're a subcontractor, so our customer's-customer is the government. ~a
[2010-12-23 10:24:28] - I had a thought exercise in my head and wondering your answer (and what others think too). Let's say the government decided tomorrow to dissolve the post office and contract out mail services to either UPS or Fed-Ex. Would you consider those company's then to be part of the public sector or private (or a little bit of both)? - mig
[2010-12-23 10:23:26] - a: is the reason you make that statement simply because the government is your private company's customer or is there more to it than that? - mig
[2010-12-23 10:03:53] - the us government. ~a
[2010-12-23 10:02:20] - i work in the public sector for a private corporation. ~a
[2010-12-23 09:57:21] - and also, was it the company that was selling the software to other foreign government or the US government? - mig
[2010-12-23 09:56:49] - but I guess I have to ask, do you consider yourself part of the public sector or private? - mig
[2010-12-23 09:54:46] - and certainly when you add foreign governments into the mix. - mig
[2010-12-23 09:52:46] - a: the whole private company doing government contracted work certainly makes the discussion harder to take the absolute yes or no stance on this axiom, sure. - mig
[2010-12-23 09:46:50] - mig: except in cases like me? ~a
[2010-12-23 09:44:41] - Now, I'm no economist, but I think the main point argued here is that the private sector creates wealth (or economic growth if you prefer to think of it that way) by promoting a cycle of people buying things, and the private sector using those profits to make more things for people to buy. That's a cycle that's just hard to see happening in the public sector. - mig
[2010-12-23 09:43:27] - Not sure I agree with all of the video's points, but I did like the restaurant example (reminds me a bit of the broken window fallacy) and thought the point about income taxes increasing the cost of labor to be interesting. -Paul
[2010-12-23 09:42:01] - as a perfect real-world example: of the last TWO huge projects i've worked on at work, our government has paid me and a bunch of other engineers to write software which was then (among other things) sold to foreign militaries. if that is not creating wealth, then i guess i don't understand economics. ~a
[2010-12-23 09:36:01] - a: ultimately I think most of us would concede that it's certainly possible that perhaps a government entity could have created or kick-started something like microsoft or apple using tax money as "VC" for it. And that is something that could be argued could have created wealth. - mig
[2010-12-23 09:28:21] - mig: well, i didn't see your last three messages when i wrote that last post. but, i think you can remove the "also" word at the beginning of my sentence. ~a
[2010-12-23 09:26:52] - mig: the government can also create wealth the same way the private sector does. there is no magic pot of gold in the private sector either. the government produces goods and services that it sells or trades to people or other governments. the government can "create" (or otherwise kick-off) whole industries. ~a
[2010-12-23 09:25:36] - I mean to say I'm NOT intending to be snide. horray for lack of sleep. - mig
[2010-12-23 09:25:11] - gah
[2010-12-23 09:22:55] - a: well can you think of a scenario where the public sector actually does create wealth? I'm intending this question to be snide or anything. I'm actually trying to answer this myself, but well looking at it through libertarian colored glasses it's obviously a difficult exercise. - mig
[2010-12-23 08:57:28] - The restaurant example was very amusing, because it highlights a very glaring flaw in the Bush "Let's give everyone a $250 check" stimulus plan a few years back. - mig
[2010-12-23 08:55:38] - xpovos; yes, very overly simplistic, but I think it has a strong main point and something that just gets ignored by stimulus proponents: government has no resources, it only has what it takes or borrows from others. - mig
[2010-12-23 08:49:10] - a: sure the government can create wealth. It can lower taxes, reduce regulartory burden, lower trade barriers, etc. - mig
[2010-12-23 01:02:19] - a: I don't think so, no. But I'm not willing to state it as universally false. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-22 23:30:22] - extremely rare? so the public sector can create wealth. i agree! yay? ~a
[2010-12-22 22:47:20] - a: No, that wasn't one of my caveats. I'd probably hesitate to say never because I'm not sufficiently aware of everything that every government does, but it is at least extremely rare that any government action increases production/GDP/wealth as we're talking about here. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-22 22:41:50] - caveats? so is it an axiom that the public sector cannot ever create wealth? or, maybe sometimes (in rare cases) it can? if the public sector can, in rare cases, create wealth . . . then "the public sector cannot create wealth" is explicitly false. ~a
[2010-12-22 22:19:24] - a: I think it's overly simplistic, but fundamentally correct within certain parameters and with certain caveats. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-22 21:23:43] - well, before we get to that, wouldn't it be better if we first found out what you think of the video? ~a
[2010-12-22 16:34:20] - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yi2l0NilEBE Idiot's guide to the public sector. I'm interested to hear what our more liberal components here think of this video. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-22 13:33:01] - has anybody else ever pulled a hangnail past the elbow, behind their neck, down the other arm to other hand's hangnail
[2010-12-22 11:05:43] - Paul: I think the philosophical argument is there too, but given the license which was ostensibly agreed to, he (and I) agree there is no ownership. That bothers us as well, but we're more willing to accept this kind of behavior. But I could be putting words into his mouth. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-22 10:32:57] - Aaron: Sure, I just thought he had a larger philosophical objection to this that had to do with renting vs owning property rather than how easy it is to enforce the law. -Paul
[2010-12-22 09:59:22] - paul: like they can fine me for speeding, but if they just put a chip in my car to automatically measure my speed, and sent me a monthly speeding bill - yeah okay, i guess in a way that's technically the same but it would piss me off. or red light cameras, or where china was using google's servers to collect evidence against some of its citizens - aaron
[2010-12-22 09:57:12] - paul: i definitely see adrian's point though. there are a lot of things the government/courts can do that i don't want them to do. and i'll tolerate that, but i still don't want people putting technology in place to make it easier - aaron
[2010-12-22 09:18:33] - title / other pc gamers: You might already all know but on the chance someone here doesn't you should check out steam on a daily basis between now and Jan 2nd. They are running sales on games that are pretty awesome. I bought 3 games last night for 7 bucks. -Daniel
[2010-12-21 14:19:39] - yes, exactly. as long as amazon doesn't take it from me without my permission/knowledge while using a hugely insecure system. ~a
[2010-12-21 12:00:50] - Census results out today, finally. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-21 10:40:21] - a: As long as Amazon doesn't do it wirelessly.
-Paul[2010-12-21 09:49:55] - "i bought it, not rented it, and you can't take back what i own. if i unknowingly bought stolen goods, i understand that the sale wasn't a legal transaction and i will gladly give back what i do not own" ~a
[2010-12-21 09:34:23] - a: No need to be sorry. I just thought your stance was more of a "I bought it, not rented it, and you can't steal back what I own" rather than a "I admit I am renting it and you are allowed to take it back, but only by coming into my home with a court order". -Paul
[2010-12-21 09:03:36] - blah, i'm really unhappy with how that message came out. in reality, i'd not be ok with either form of "taking back" the book. i'd really want neither situation to happen. ~a
[2010-12-21 08:53:59] - sentence 1: yes, exactly. sentence 2: yes, if "their right" is the right of the copyright holder, not amazon's right. sentence 3: sorry? how so. ~a
[2010-12-21 08:48:18] - a: So it's more a practical matter for you than one of legal philosopy? You are ok with their right to take back the e-book but just don't like their method of doing it? That seems to run counter to the stance I thought you were taking. -Paul
[2010-12-20 21:46:33] - The Vikings defense is distressingly bad. Oh, wait. So is their offense. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 17:23:17] - former. definitely and by far. the former is more difficult, much less likely to actually happen, and doesn't open me up to hackers, disgruntled employees, and wayward policies. ~a
[2010-12-20 17:18:40] - a: I guess the real question, then, is whether you would be happier if Amazon had to come into your house to physically press the delete button on your kindle rather than doing it wirelessly. -Paul
[2010-12-20 17:17:31] - however . . . given that amazon doesn't revoke their power to control our devices, AND such a court order existed, again i'd be pissed off at the government for giving out such a court order, but not in amazon for carrying it out. ~a
[2010-12-20 17:14:48] - paul: well, remember, i'm not happy that amazon set up a system where that is even possible. if amazon's device did not allow reverse wireless read/write access, and such a court order existed, then amazon would be unable to comply with the court order. ~a
[2010-12-20 16:58:37] - a: What if it was a court order to wirelessly delete the e-book from your machine instead of having to come into your house to remove it? -Paul
[2010-12-20 16:43:35] - "Would you be ok with it if Amazon got a court order to delete stuff from your kindle?" hmm, well they would have to get a court order to come into my house to reposes the data. i think they would have a hard time getting such a court order. but yeah, i'd be pissed off at the government for giving out such a court order, but not in amazon for carrying it out. ~a
[2010-12-20 16:35:47] - Meanwhile the customer still has his copy and depending may have a lawsuit against the erroneous publisher as well for an inferior product. Probably could be negotiated with Amazon for a refund while Amazon lawyers handle the heavy lifting to avoid class-action problems. But if the purchaser is content, no harm on his end. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 16:33:07] - Whereas with the 1984 situation, there was a legitimate version available for more. Amazon owes Orwell's estate for the lost sale (here's $15) and Amazon has a lawsuit against the erroneous publisher for violating their terms of service. ($15 plus damages plus legal fees plus get off our servers and never come back). -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 16:31:07] - Paul: Probably needs congressional action. But even that is tricky. Say some neo-Luddite writes the epic "The Coming Computer Apocalypse: How you can renounce technology and survive". Obviously he wants to publish, but also obviously he doesn't want an e-book version ever. If it's stolen and republished as an e-book there really is no monetary recourse. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 16:23:14] - Xpovos: So how would you solve the third case? -Paul
[2010-12-20 16:10:19] - Woo, double-tapped the post. Sorry. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 16:06:38] - The third isn't, and is in my opinion a gross abuse of the copyright privilege. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 16:06:37] - The third isn't, and is in my opinion a gross abuse of the copyright privilege. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 16:05:37] - Paul: With the car: the car needs to go back to the owner in order for restitution to be made; or a sufficient amount of money to buy a new car. With the digital item, there's only money. So, either the purchase price wasn't enough, or it was going to the wrong person, or it shouldn't have been sold. The first two are solveable with legal action. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 16:02:44] - a: Would you be ok with it if Amazon got a court order to delete stuff from your kindle? I would guess that wouldn't make a difference to you. Besides, do cops need court orders to repossess stolen goods? -paul
[2010-12-20 16:01:45] - Xpovos: Sure, but in the case of a stolen car being purchased, it was the person who sold it who (presumably) stole the car, not the purchaser. I'm not sure I understand your point. -Paul
[2010-12-20 16:00:45] - of worms... -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 16:00:31] - If the argument is that the end user didn't pay enough, then it falls to Amazon, since it was their lack of due diligence that permitted the theft, and they can attempt legal mitigation against the actual violater. If the argument is that the right is non-existant for that user (or anyone) then I have significant issue with copyright being granted, but that's a legal can
[2010-12-20 15:57:28] - Paul: The copyright holder has two arguments in this case. The car owner has one. The copyright holder can argue: the end user didn't pay enough, or that the end user can't have it period. The car owner only needs his one argument since the physical property aspect means that his conveyance is gone. Beyond that difference... (cont)
[2010-12-20 15:56:04] - because if they did, i might reconsider my viewpoint. ~a
[2010-12-20 15:55:38] - paul: did amazon have a court order? ~a
[2010-12-20 15:52:28] - a: Sure, Amazon != cops, but in this matter, what difference does it make? In both cases, stolen property was taken away from somebody who thought they were making a legal purchase, right? -Paul
[2010-12-20 15:52:07] - Paul: If it was stolen material, it was Amazon that stole it, not the users. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 15:51:34] - paul: the cops cannot enter your property and delete stolen property from your computer without a court order. ~a
[2010-12-20 15:51:28] - a: Yes, that's the point was clarifying with my second post. Amazon != state authority. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 15:50:21] - Xpovos: I won't claim to have come up with it on my own, it was from a CNET article I just read about it. His point was that Amazon was perfectly justified in deleting the e-books since it was stolen material and that the cops would do the same thing. Wasn't sure if he was right about the cops or not, though. -Paul
[2010-12-20 15:48:21] - xpovos/paul: no no, bad example.
"don't the cops end up taking it away?" amazon != cops. also there's a ton of limits as to what the cops can take from you without your permission. ~a[2010-12-20 15:44:50] - Paul: Heck, the police impounded my father's car after he was in a car accident (20+ years ago). It was evidence against the guy who hit him. So, there's definitely a lot of legal precedent for the state taking away property. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 15:36:55] - Paul: Yes, I think they do (stolen car) that's probably the best example we've got yet. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 15:34:55] - aaron: I saw trailers for that movie. Looked bad, but in an interesting sort of way. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 15:34:34] - Paul: And if I stop paying my credit card bill, they'll cease letting me make new purchases, because those are services. I don't own my house (yet). The bank owns it, and I pay them for the service of letting me live in it (mortgage/rent). Once I own it, only the gov't can take it away. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 15:33:28] - a: Technically, did you even license the food if you didn't pay for it? I guess this example is a little more complicated thanks to the credit card. -Paul
[2010-12-20 15:31:45] - Honest question: But if somebody buys what turns out to be a stolen car, don't the cops end up taking it away? -Paul
[2010-12-20 15:29:18] - xpovos: you only licensed that food. you don't own it. ~a
[2010-12-20 15:29:17] - Xpovos: Sure, but if you buy a house and stop making mortgage payments, the bank will absolutely take the house back. -Paul
[2010-12-20 15:28:54] - xpovos: there was a movie called Repo_Men which (i heard) was about medical companies tracking people down and taking back their organs that they hadn't paid for
- aaron[2010-12-20 15:25:31] - I mean, example: I eat at a resturant, then I pay with a credit card. If I later don't pay my credit card bill, the restaurant doesn't try to come and pump my stomach for their food back. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 15:24:40] - Paul: There's separate credit card arbitrage already in place. Works fine, no need to complicate it. Usually it's beneficial to the consumer. But Amazon could always just lock you out of future purchases until you paid if it came to that. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 15:24:02] - paul: yes maybe. ~a
[2010-12-20 15:23:16] - And then you can absolutely have a terms of service on your selling platform against selling copyrighted materials (where you don't hold the right). That's fine. Works all around, if the lawsuits are sufficiently painful for violators. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 15:23:15] - a: I guess the compromise would be to not allow refunds and to wait until credit card transactions go through before e-books are allowed to be downloaded, then? -Paul
[2010-12-20 15:22:56] - "only the purchaser of the kindle could write to it...from a hardware perspective" from a "hardware" perspective? are you talking about two processors too? if not, then you're going to have to explain further. ~a
[2010-12-20 15:22:05] - The issue with the Orwell story isn't the kill switch (that's universally bad) but that Amazon was stupid enough to let people sell a product through their service without vetting the rights. The action should have been: remove it from the market, sue the illegal seller, settle with the rights holder. The consumer had no place in that arbitrage. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 15:20:28] - aaron: "for public libraries" ugh. so now you're talking about "renting" (or borrowing) digital material? that's hard; i don't think you can do that very easily. ~a
[2010-12-20 15:19:55] - a: i mean what if it was impossible from a hardware perspective? what if there were two hard drives - one for "rented" content and one for "purchased" content and the second one was write-protected in a way that only the purchaser of the kindle could write to it. would that be OK? - aaron
[2010-12-20 15:18:47] - a: yeah i totally agree, i want that too. but i'm a "consumer", and that's selfish of me. "producers" want the exact opposite, and i think the correct answer is some sort of a compromise. - aaron
[2010-12-20 15:18:26] - paul: that they won't isn't going far enough. it's that they still can if they change their minds and decide they want to. ~a
[2010-12-20 15:18:09] - I understand you guys don't want Amazon to be able to do anything to your (hypothetical) kindles, but how else are they supposed to deal with that issue when dealing with something purely digital like an e-book? -Paul
[2010-12-20 15:17:43] - a: but like paul says, there are cases like - for public libraries, where the kindle is a more viable platform if there is a way amazon can guarantee book sellers that books on your kindle will become unreadable when they want... so i think they need some kind of "M4P" type format, i just think they need to spell it out that that is the only kind of file - aaron
[2010-12-20 15:17:17] - aaron: negative. if they can delete m4p files, they can delete/change/read other files. i don't want companies to stop deleting files on my devices: i want them to stop making devices where that's even possible. ~a
[2010-12-20 15:17:07] - Honestly, I'm not trying to take a side here, just trying to understand. Amazon's stance in that quote sounded pretty reasonable, in that it sounds like they'll only delete an e-book from your kindle if you're trying to steal it in some way. -Paul
[2010-12-20 15:15:34] - paul: i think xpovos is right. i can't get refunds on mp3s. also, amazon cannot delete mp3s off of my hard-drive. ~a
[2010-12-20 15:13:39] - xpovos: or just have different file extensions, like iTunes' m4a versus m4p, and amazon can just put it in writing like, "if you're dumb enough to pay money for an M4P file, then we might take your money and give you nothing in return, because we're assholes like that. but other than M4P files we'll never touch anything on your kindle" - aaron
[2010-12-20 15:10:27] - Paul: I understand it's complex. "No refunds" is a reasonable policy for certain kinds of products (e.g. wedding dresses, condoms... wait, why did I put those two in the same sentence) so I would accept a no refund policy on ebooks before I'd accept a "we'll claw it back if you want a refund". -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 15:08:35] - a: I'm not sure if that's sarcasm, or gallows humor. Either way, I think there's a pretty significant difference between the softare/firmware on the Kindle (which I'll sign a TOS license agreement on) vs. media (which I won't). -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 15:06:54] - paul: no, they do whatever microsoft does. wait, what does microsoft do? ~a
[2010-12-20 15:04:31] - a: That's fair enough, but in the case of e-books, what would you propose Amazon do if you don't pay for a e-book you downloaded or demand a refund? Just let you have the e-book for free? -Paul
[2010-12-20 15:03:31] - Aaron: Ok, I can understand that. -Paul
[2010-12-20 15:00:13] - paul: see my next example as an explanation: if i fail to pay for microsoft office (or ask for a refund), microsoft cannot, and should not be able to, connect to my computer and delete it. ~a
[2010-12-20 14:59:51] - paul: personally, i find it unsatisfactory because they basically pinky-swore that they wouldn't do it again - they didn't write it into their EULA or somehow put it into some kind of legally binding agreement - aaron
[2010-12-20 14:58:04] - a: Why is that quote an example of it being unsatisfactory? You think you should be able to keep e-books that you don't pay for or ask for a refund for? -Paul
[2010-12-20 14:55:12] - xpovos: yeah that's pretty awful. it's also one of the reasons i get my music at amazon instead of iTunes, and why i avoided Steam (until Civ5 came out) - aaron
[2010-12-20 14:53:54] - yes, i agree that is fucked up. never ever ever pay for digital content that is licensed and is not sold. for example . . . most of the software you are currently using? ~a
[2010-12-20 14:52:26] - a: that's right, i'm mostly worried about accidentally searching and replacing something bad. i want to be able to hit "n", look at what it matched, and then decide on a case-by-case basis if i want to replace it. most applications like notepad/msword have this kind of feature, and i can kind of do it in VI it's just a little hard - aaron
[2010-12-20 14:49:14] - a: If I fail to pay for it, I'd never get it in the first place. Here's the line from the TOS. Deathknell. "Unless otherwise specified, Digital Content is licensed, not sold, to you by the Content Provider." -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 14:46:05] - if i fail to pay for microsoft office, microsoft cannot (and should not be able to) connect to my computer and delete it. ~a
[2010-12-20 14:44:26] - "the company vowed not to remotely delete e-books from users' Kindles again except for cases where a user fails to pay for an e-book or asks for a refund" you are correct: most unsatisfactory. ~a
[2010-12-20 14:42:48] - a: Kind of what I figured, which is extremely disappointing. I want a digital framework for my books so that I can elminate clutter and confusion from future purchase decisions. Kindle seems the best choice for that, so I want to like it. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 14:41:12] - Right now this is the latest I can find on it, and it's not very satisfactory. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 14:36:31] - xpovos: it has not progressed. (amazon still has complete control over your device and your data; aka your "property") ~a
[2010-12-20 14:35:21] - AH. ok. regarding "manual": so you know about :%s/hotdog/hamburger/g and that's not what you want, right? 'cause you can modify the s/// to only operate on a subset of the file. ~a
[2010-12-20 14:35:04] - I'm potentially interested in buying an e-reader, particularly a Kindle, but this still looms in my memory. Does anyone know how that situation has progressed? -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 14:18:44] - a: changes all letters up to and including the letter "g" - aaron
[2010-12-20 13:13:35] - aaron: you have to tell me what "cfg" does. 'cause i don't follow. ~a
[2010-12-20 10:55:47] - vi_users: so to do a manual search/replace in vi (not a replace all), i /hotdog to find occurances of hotdog, then do something like n, cfghamburger^[, n.n.n.n.... my question is, is there some generic alternative to cfg for finding the entire searched-for word - aaron
[2010-12-20 10:55:23] - daniel: apparently a website that would cause you to engage in a thought crime. ~a
[2010-12-20 10:03:26] - daniel: apparently they're related to P2P? i have trouble reading a lot of articles slashdot links to, anything related to TPB or similar sites - aaron
[2010-12-20 09:54:05] - a: blocked for me too. What kind of website are you trying to send us to?! -Daniel
[2010-12-20 09:02:04] - a: Blocked. Woo. I'll have to check it out later. -- Xpovos
[2010-12-20 08:36:34] - why the us government attacking wikileaks is a bad idea. ~a
[2010-12-20 08:35:15] - ouch. 7 hours didn't quench my thirst for sleep. and i doubt the ambien helped. ~a
[2010-12-19 21:39:49] - a: take two ambien and call me in the morning. - pierce
[2010-12-19 06:25:50] - i am painfully sleepy. ~a
prev <-> next