we put poor people in jail for a lot of things that rich people don't go to jail for

If it were me, I'd probably be tossing Hegseth as well, but he's a Trump pet.  So that won't happen. -- Xpovos It seems likely that Walz's head will roll--eventually.  But this was an unforced error of a SNAFU.  Totally witless. -- Xpovos paul: "having Goldberg on a war planning signal chat was bad?" yes that's right.  conservative Reddit and lahren think heads should roll vs "I honestly don't know much else about what might have been done wrong".  ~a a: I'm going to be honest. I have no idea what you're talking about in terms of me being too conservative. In terms of what? That... Clinton shouldn't have had a private email server and having Goldberg on a war planning signal chat was bad? -Paul 0.5 trillion onto the deficit ffs.  the debt payments on that alone will negate any savings in perpetuity.  we always knew doge was going to be an ironic name, but i don't think we could have predicted, how ironic, exactly.  ~a paul:  "Is it not secure enough"  that's correct.  especially this scenario:  on high side email boxes you can still email the wrong person, but it'll be in a much smaller set of people that are at least cleared to the level of the thing you're sending.  like, literally the networks are separated the physical layer.  if you plug a S computer into a TS ethernet cable it won't work.  (also you'll be in trouble, but that's a different issue) ~a paul:  there's also this thing.  you're not supposed to release battle damage assessments (or classified intel in general) willy nilly because it reveals the details of your intelligence agents behind enemy lines.  ~a paul:  according to npr, tomi lahren feels you're too conservative for her, as well.  ~a paul:  they can't decide if it's a show of strength to punish rule breakers:  or if it is a show of strength to suggest rule breakers that work for him don't need to follow the law.  ~a paul:  i read the "conservative" reddit.  it's not exactly a fair view of what conservatives think in general. . . . buuut the conservatives of reddit think your views are too conservative for even them.  goldberg had the goods; so he wasn't lying; there was clearly highly classified information there:  they think the whitehouse should have immediately fired waltz and "dressed down" hegseth/gabbard.  ~a paul:  and gabbard lying to congress?  is that not "what might have been done wrong"?  ~a paul:  "I honestly don't know much else about what might have been done wrong"  what?  what about the hegseth thing?  prior plans of an attack in the future?  highly classified TS data?  the kind of information that gets american service-members killed and wounded?  that is "much else about what might have been done wrong"?  . . . ?  ~a paul:  "didn't Clinton do the same thing in terms of deleting emails?"  according to "the former head of litigation at NARA, described the practice as 'highly unusual' but not a violation of the law".  in other words, according to this lawyer, they were following the laws that govern NARA.  ~a a: Either way, I want to be clear, this seems pretty bad on all sorts of levels. Including the level that nobody seems to be talking about: Why are we bombing Yemen? -Paul a: I have no idea what a low side communications channel is. Are you referring to signal? Is it not secure enough? -Paul a: Although it is ironic if the data deletion is problematic, because didn't Clinton do the same thing in terms of deleting emails? -Paul a: I was referring to the inclusion of the journalist on the signal group. I honestly don't know much else about what might have been done wrong. I just found out about the data deletion last night. -Paul paul:  what hegseth did was probably the worst offense morally.  but gabbard blatantly lying to congress is also arguably maybe the worst legally?  ~a paul:  hegseth took high side TS classified and protected data and put it in a low side communications channel.  that is serious prison time.  i assume you don't mean that mistake.  ~a paul:  "This appears to have been a single mistake"  ??? oh, which mistake?  waltz selected "1 week" for data to be deleted (and later changed to 4 weeks).  the laws that regulate communications between any two government officials forbids the destruction of data within 1 week or 4 weeks:  all this data is legally required to be sent to NARA for later declassification.  i assume you don't mean that mistake.  ~a a: "europe and china have proven strategies for implementation" But the US isn't Europe and China. We have different geographies and systems of government and political realities. What about recent US history makes you think high speed rail is workable here? -Paul a: "i know you're joking.  but, no" Counter-point: The email server was done deliberately, and intentionally, with multiple decisions involved. This appears to have been a single mistake. Still, I think it's fair to say both were bad. -Paul a: "local media is mostly owned by sinclair inc" I don't think a significant portion of media coverage of national COVID lockdowns would be produced/consumed by local media. That seems more the purview of cable news and national news. -Paul a: "if high speed rail is cheaper, easier, (sometimes) faster, without the long TSA lines, then why?" Convenience? Maybe they disagree about it being easier or cheaper? Remember how we disagreed about whether Metro was superior to driving into DC? -Paul a: Maybe, but I just don't know if it makes sense to build out all the infrastructure everywhere for trains which might be marginally better for medium length trips when we already have infrastructure for cars and planes which can fill that purpose almost as well. -Paul a: To me, planes are clearly superior for long distance travel. And for local (ie, to the local grocery store or school or whatever) trains seem clearly to not be an option. Could trains be a slightly better option for those medium length trips (~100 miles)? -Paul a: "but there are very few jobs i think the car is best suited for" Right, I almost preempted this by mentioning that this feels to me like an extension of your thoughts on cars vs bikes where one option seems clearly better but for some reason you prefer the other. -Paul a:  i mean ask James Clapper. - mig i know lying to congress is usually a "no no".  is that no longer a thing?  ~a mig:  yeah, i did not predict this happening at all.  "i assume she knows jeffrey goldberg won't out her obvious lies because he'd be breaking the law to do so"  this was me like 24 hours ago.  ~a still dunce cap on me for today. - mig a:  stand corrected, though still annoyed at the Atlantic for the paywall. - mig mig: "None of this seems particularly sensitive"  ???  i'd feel weird quoting specific updates, because this is 100% TS.  hell, i feel very weird *reading* this:  knowingly reading TS stuff not for you is very against the rules.  these plans were distributed before any troops were in contact: that is the kind of information that gets american service-members killed and wounded. i feel weird even saying this much in a public place.  ~a mig:  i had to click "option 3" here to read, but ymmv.  ~a A big what the fucking fuck to the atlantic for paywalling their article that released the full chat btw. - mig This is still very embarrassing for the administration but from a national security perspective this seems like a big fat nothing burger. - mig a: https://x.com/shawn_farash/status/1904876980496970010 full signal chat.  None of this seems particularly sensitive.  Gabbard seems to be correct.  Calling this “war plans” seems to be a real stretch. - mig paul:  "not using eminent domain"  why?  ~a paul:  "Do you think that's at all practical given the realities on the ground in California and what has happened so far?"  wholly and emphatically yes.  maybe not in california.  maybe not in 2025.  but i say we can start digging in 2026.  europe and china have proven strategies for implementation.  ~a paul:  "is this better or worse than a private email server"  i know you're joking.  but, no.  this is not the same.  there were no target priorities discussed.  there were no weapons packages chosen.  cia assets were not exposed.  timing and details of dod engagements were not discussed.  zero TS data was found.  no journalists were invited into private conversations.  bringing up the email server is an indictment:  not an excuse.    ~a paul:  "leanings of the mainstream media"  local media is mostly owned by sinclair inc.  so, with that in mind, you think the leanings of the mainstream media would expose you to pro-covid viewpoints more, or less, i'm not sure i follow that.  "generally liberal leaning friends"   ok.  ~a paul:  "I'm guessing a lot of people would still opt for flying"  if high speed rail is cheaper, easier, (sometimes) faster, without the long TSA lines, then why?  i mean some would, because some people are irrational.  but i think a significant majority would take the cheaper, easier, faster choice that doesn't have long TSA lines.  ~a paul:  "cars serve a much different purpose than planes? Or trains?"  train trips can steal (the wasted fuel, and wasted money, and unreliability, and lines from) long car trips or domestic plane trips.  they serve a different purpose how?  i'm all about *not* having a one-size-fits all tool, but instead using the right tool for each job.  but there are very few jobs i think the car is best suited for:  outside of rural areas, that is.  ~a a: reducing carbon emissions and not using eminent domain and the list goes on and on. -Paul a: Which make high speed rail nearly impossible. It's not just a matter of "doing it the right way", you need to reverse the whole idea of researching environmental concerns and serving "underserved communities" and... -Paul a: "Let us make high speed rail the right way?" Do you think that's at all practical given the realities on the ground in California and what has happened so far? It seems to me there are multiple layers of regulations... -Paul a: "weren't you saying that you didn't know many people that used signal?" Not trying to do whataboutism, just a bad joke, but is this better or worse than a private email server? -Paul a: So now maybe it's not that more people are anti-lockdown, but we just area hearing more from them? And realizing there were more than we thought? And that's making the mainstream media sit up and take notice? -Paul a: I suspect that before, given the leanings of the mainstream media and social media censorship and my own personal bubble (Northern Virginia and generally liberal leaning friends), I didn't get a lot of exposure to people who were anti-lockdown almost from the start. -Paul a: I realized I never replied to your bit about Rogan/Musk lower information quality. That wasn't the point I was trying to get at. I wasn't talking about information quality, I was talking about being exposed to the opinions of Americans. -Paul a: Even for a rail line that makes the most sense (I would assume Miami -> DC -> NY generally) I'm guessing a lot of people would still opt for flying. -Paul a: In a country the size of the US, and with the pre-existing infrastructure that we have in terms of airports and roads. -Paul a: But cars serve a much different purpose than planes? Or trains? I'm perfectly willing to be in incompetent politicians screwing up high speed rail, but that still doesn't mean high speed rail would necessarily make sense... -Paul tulsi gabbard:  "there was no classified information that was shared in that signal chat".  she just lied. to. congress.  full stop.  jeffrey goldberg has all of that evidence, what is she doing?  i assume she knows jeffrey goldberg won't out her obvious lies because he'd be breaking the law to do so.  ~a mig:  imagine the same number of units as sfh.  it would be insanity?  ~a mig:  oh, i'm 100% the same way.  i'm an outdoorsy person who loves skyline drive / shenandoah national park / shenandoah valley / george washington national forest / etc.  i spend a lot of time outside walking, riding, and taking public transit.  i see "apartment and condo buildings" as better for scenic views than the equivalent number of sfh units.  it's not even close, right?  it's like . . . orders of magnitude better?  ~a a:  Michelle is a very scenic person so she is hating seeing all the apartment and condo buildings everywhere that are blocking her “views” - mig