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[2012-01-23 12:42:45] - Daniel: Agreed. The phrase "Baby brings his own bread", is not universal. In those cases adoption may be the only option under my moral framework, as so definied. Preferably charity was involved prior to that, but there's no exclusion for it here. But failing that, yes... adoption. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 12:40:37] - Xpovos: I'm mostly watching from the sidelines here on yall's discussion but your point that you were able to afford your unexpected child doesn't mean that there aren't people who legitimately can't afford a child of their own (they are already homeless, jobless, etc). -Daniel
[2012-01-23 12:40:20] - a: I'll refer you to my previous statement about biological imperatives vs. impossibilities. That's one argument I don't think we can take any further. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 12:38:13] - "Father R wasn't providing sufficient support in the first place" or because abstinence fails about 110% of the time? ~a
[2012-01-23 12:35:58] - a: Back to your hypothetical situation. That situation probably arises because Father R wasn't providing sufficient support in the first place, which does limit my argument somewhat that Father R suddenly get involved and provide support now. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 12:35:46] - sorry, that was in response to your previous post. ~a
[2012-01-23 12:35:17] - it does, i agree. ~a
[2012-01-23 12:34:58] - a: Hmm. I know several people who at least claim they remained virgins til marriage. They may be lying. I also work closely with a significant population that has forsworn (further?) sexual activity. Sex is not an inevitability, even if it feels that way. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 12:33:31] - a: Yes. And if Father R is smart he provides significant support during the process. Unfortunately, what I've seen too often (anecdotally, again) is that the Fathers R in that position disown Daughter R because of the promiscuity... that does nothing to advance the agenda and does serious harm, both to the agenda and the people involved. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 12:32:19] - i know you have first hand experience with children. i have none. in fact, i really have absolutely no first hand experience in any of these related topics. but we also share one thing: a lack of first-hand experience with our grandchildren. many young daughters are getting pregnant because abstinence fails like 110% of the time. ~a
[2012-01-23 12:30:37] - situation: daughter R #1 can't go on the pill because father R is a strict catholic that doesn't even believe in condoms. daughter R #1 fails at being abstinent and gets pregnant (because, let's be honest, abstinence sucks). does father R instruct daughter R #1 to carry the child to term . . . while still in high-school? ~a
[2012-01-23 12:29:45] - a: I won't deny that. Again, I have first hand experience. Although it's probably a bit of a stretch to say my daughters are unwanted. Unexpected is probably more precise. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 12:27:56] - taking care of an unwanted child has tons of side-affects itself. ~a
[2012-01-23 12:26:02] - a: Or keep the child themselves. As a financially strapped parent of two, I can say that just because I thought I couldn't afford another child does not mean that I've ended up on the streets because of the second child... so far. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 12:22:36] - so should all these mothers be choosing adoption (except the ones that die from birth-complications)? ~a
[2012-01-23 12:21:18] - mig: Its not quite as good as you are hoping (though still positive) http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2012/01/scotus-gps-ruling/ has 5 justices saying law enforcement can't just gps track w/o a warrant and 4 justices saying "well it depends on how long" -Daniel
[2012-01-23 12:20:12] - Table three from the linked document is probably the most significant, as it identifies what each woman obtaining an abortion in this survey detailed as the "most important" reason for the abortion. If health of self/fetus isn't the most important, than it's clearly not a pressing concern where at this point both CANNOT be saved. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 12:18:37] - For reference, I'm going to try to pull most of my statistics from the Guttmacher Institute. They're extremely pro-abortion. But they also have solid numbers backing things up. I figure that cuts my bias and give hard data. http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/journals/3711005.pdf -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 12:17:45] - paul: I think a is still in the phase of drawing out my position to fully understand how deep the rabbit hole goes and see if I'm logically consistent. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 12:14:04] - paul: i follow. ~a
[2012-01-23 12:13:51] - a: I mean, if a mom kills one of her kids because it has some birth defect or because she can't afford to feed it, I would think she would be prosecuted for murder. -Paul
[2012-01-23 12:12:47] - a: Completely my own opinion, and not an attempt to explain Xpovos' views, but if you consider abortion to be the termination of a human life, and therefore murder (which isn't necessarily how I see it), then fetal defects or not being able to afford a fourth kid probably wouldn't be good reasons to have an abortion. -Paul
[2012-01-23 12:08:08] - Note: I cede 6% is not infinitesimal. So, let me revise the previous statement to "small". I'll stick with infinitesimal elsewhere, but let's work with the 6% number that I can more easily defend at this time. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 12:05:42] - a: 6% ceiling. And that includes mental health reasons and a large number of cases which do not fit my strict "CANNOT" save both requirement. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 12:04:41] - mig: Unsurprising, but good news all the same. There are some other cases that are less clear cut that I'm hoping for some good rulings on. Like Florida vs. Jardines. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 12:03:01] - how rare? ~a
[2012-01-23 12:01:36] - a: But, let's be honest, such cases are extremely rare and represent an infinitesimal portion of the 1.4 million abortions each year in the U.S. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 12:00:53] - not to derail but scotus gets one right. and unanimously right of all things! - mig
[2012-01-23 12:00:08] - a: Agreed on both counts. And I believe that my position is consistent with maintaining the maternal life as equally important to maintaining the fetal life. In those cases where both CANNOT be preserved, and a choice must be made to preserve one, but not the other, either choice is acceptable. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 11:58:42] - that puts you in a class with very few members. maternal life is something that many people consider important. ~a
[2012-01-23 11:55:51] - a: So you'll find I'm in the redish range of orange there. I, for example, wouldn't grant an exemption for mental health the way that some orange would. And depending on how Chile's laws are written, they might be an accurate reflection of my views. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 11:53:55] - a: Opposed. Generally I'm not in favor of even the screening for those because they'll encourage what I consider to be bad behavior, but I'm not in favor of making screening illegal. There is something to, "forewarned is forearmed", even if the practical solution of "cut the enemy off at the pass" is precluded. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 11:52:52] - a bunch of other situations are discussed in File:Abortion Laws.svg ~a
[2012-01-23 11:52:40] - a: Because an operation which is required to save the life of a mother which has the side effect of terminating the pregnancy (classic example is an ectopic pregnancy) has very little in common with an abortion of convenience. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 11:52:09] - also what about fetal defects? or the chance of fetal defects? ~a
[2012-01-23 11:50:25] - why? "save the life of the mother" is one of many great situations. so is: i have three kids and i can't afford to take care of a fourth let alone the first three. ~a
[2012-01-23 11:48:20] - a: Personally, yes. I believe that abortion should be illegal in every case, including rape and incest. The 'save the life of the mother' argument has merit, but principle of dual-effect is WAY complicated and not suitable to the discussion now, I think. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 11:40:46] - so, do you consider anti-abortion is a hard-and-fast stance? should anti-abortion be taken to the point where no situation should warrant an abortion? ~a
[2012-01-23 11:39:38] - haha, sure. for the purpose of this conversation, i'll use your labels here and today only.
~a[2012-01-23 11:36:01] - a: 100% pro-somesubset(abortion), we'll define now as "pro-abortion". I'll not call my postion "pro-life" to be fair. We'll term it "anti-abortion". Thus removing emotional loading and some falsehoods from our semantics. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 11:35:00] - a: Pro choice as I used it there is 100% license, aka, anarchy/state of nature. In that environment I could choose to do anything until such point as someone chose to stop me by use of enough force. These things are eliminated by the social contract, that is the unwritten rule to forgo choice for expediency and safety. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 11:31:45] - "so since no one (sane) is 100% pro-choice" i'm 100% pro-choice so maybe we have a definitions problem. "pro-choice" = "support for the legalization of abortion" well, that is still not totally defined, but i'm 100% for the legalization of some subset of that. ~a
[2012-01-23 11:29:10] - (sorry for the length, it's a complex argument) -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 11:28:30] - We see with drugs now, and will with smoking and junk food that making something illegal won't actually eliminate it. Prohibition of something strongly desired doesn't work. In order to eliminate abortion, it has to be a cultural shift to make it so that people will not strongly desire abortions. Then it won't even need to be illegal. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 11:27:31] - So since no one (sane) is 100% pro-choice (murder is a wrong choice) and I have substantial evidence linking abortion to murder, it's a choice I can't abide, and am OK with making it illegal for the same reasons. But unfotunately, that's not going to get the problem fixed. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 11:26:02] - The difference is also the nature of who gets hurt. All of these choices inflict some self-harm. The difference is that abortion also inflicts a direct, permanent and terminal secondary harm. The rest of the choices inflict potentially ongoing and nuisance secondary harms (externalities). -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 11:24:45] - We all generally also agree (except for the wackos, who I'm content to ignore on all issues mentioned so far) that abortion is a last-choice. The difference between the three is that abortion is legal and people are fighting to keep it so, drugs are illegal (generally) and people are fighting to keep it so, and smoking and junk food are legal, but not for long?
[2012-01-23 11:23:21] - a: I think the issue with choice is that we get upset when people make the wrong choices. For some the wrong choice is doing drugs. For others, it's smoking, or eating junk food. For 'us', it's abortion. We all agree that doing drugs, particularly to excess, smoking (generally at all) or eating junk food is bad. {...} -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 11:20:51] - Xpovos: http://www.cnn.com/2012/01/23/politics/rand-paul-tsa/index.html?hpt=hp_t3 Here is a CNN article about it. Doesn't have much more info, other than he was let go and allowed to leave (but presumably not catch his flight). -Paul
[2012-01-23 11:18:44] - here is fine
~a[2012-01-23 11:15:22] - a: I'd also comment on the March today, but I don't want to do it on Facebook. If you want to hold that discussion here, let me know. Otherwise I'll drop it. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 11:13:20] - it's super awesome that this happened to a senator. ~a
[2012-01-23 11:07:54] - It's making the rounds, but Sen. Rand Paul (R-KY) has been detained by the TSA in Nashville after the backscatter scan showed an 'anomaly' and he refused a pat-down and the TSA refused to perform a second backscatter scan. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-23 10:50:04] - although it's possible the bill also might have been stronger at one point but then got stripped down during the amendment process. - mig
[2012-01-23 10:39:04] - nina: because of the belief that supporting flawed legislation is better than "doing nothing"? I don't subscribe tot that philosophy but it seems popular among the pols in DC these days. - mig
[2012-01-23 09:49:57] - aaron/a: i wasn't being sarcastic. I didn't read the bill, but saw that the Humane Society supported it, so wondered what the discrepancy was about. Still not sure why the Humane Society would support a bill that would allow for puppy mills. -nina
[2012-01-23 09:19:33] - For those of you not delayed, here's some slightly delayed humor. http://mthruf.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/job-fails-i-think-theyre-kind-of-missing-the-point-but-hey-thats-just-me.jpg -- Xpovos
[2012-01-20 15:00:58] - title: I want to see this as an xkcd comic now. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-20 14:45:30] - I don't know if I've posted this before. "Every problem in the universe can be solved by finding the right long-haired prettyboy and beating the crap out of him." -- Xpovos
[2012-01-20 14:16:25] - oh, wow. the megaupload guys were indicted in alexandria. i wonder why. why not, i guess. ~a
[2012-01-20 12:36:22] - sopa supporters and opponents changed a lot over night wednesday. if this was just a stunt, then i think sometimes stunts work. ~a
[2012-01-20 11:10:04] - oh wow i like your source better than mine. ~a
[2012-01-20 11:08:43] - mig: it's like a hate crime, but a little more... meh. instead of assaulting someone because of their race, maybe you're just - arguing with them a little, or saying something mean. source - aaron
[2012-01-20 11:08:24] - aka hate crime. ~a
[2012-01-20 10:53:22] - i'm still confused as to what a "bias crime" is. - mig
[2012-01-20 10:35:09] - mig: Well... that's going to test some new ground on speech laws if it goes high enough. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-20 09:57:17] - "They should see jail time for it" ok, wow. these moms lost all of my remaining support from those seven simple words. ~a
[2012-01-20 09:40:09] - http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/wifi-signal-racist-anti-semitic-slur-teaneck-nj-sparks-police-probe-signal-rec-center-router-article-1.1008135 police try to find the name of an offensive wireless SSID ... for some vague reason. - mig
[2012-01-19 16:24:09] - yes, he either got lucky (which is what i'm hoping) or he knew (which i'm hoping not). the reason i'm hoping it's the first is because, if it's the second, then i have to seriously worry about what he'll be doing with the data. on the identity/data-theft front, i'm partially covered, but not completely. ~a
[2012-01-19 16:22:24] - xpovos: sure. i think he broke that window because it makes less noise. i think he was a pro . . . which leads into aaron's question. this guy (imo) is a professional so i doubt he knew me personally, i doubt he had been following me, i doubt he saw me put the laptop in the trunk (in fact i may have done that before i parked; i forget). ~a
[2012-01-19 16:20:56] - the chances of breaking into a car with something that expensive are probably like what, one in 20? one in 50? i feel like either the thief got very lucky, or somehow he knew - aaron
[2012-01-19 16:18:14] - i wonder how they guessed you had a laptop? i mean the most resellable thing in my car is either the stuffed animal in my back seat or the board games in my trunk. do you think he followed you home, or knew you personally, or something like that? - aaron
[2012-01-19 15:47:16] - At least(?) the thief only broke a small non-restractable window. When my GPS was stolen, they smashed the passenger-side window. Much more of a pain to clean up and make sure everything's functional again. But I only lost the GPS, not a laptop. Losing a laptop with all that data is much worse. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-19 15:43:32] - thanks, guys. well anyways, please learn from my mistake: never keep a laptop in your car overnight. EVEN hidden or in your trunk. if it's hidden, they'll still find it after they've decided to break your window and rummage through your stuff. he checked every compartment of the vehicle. pics ~a
[2012-01-19 15:06:12] - a: i don't think someone would steal a thermometer. maybe... maybe one of your neighbors is just participating in a very unethical scavenger hunt
- aaron[2012-01-19 15:00:54] - a: Normally not. Strange that it did, sorry. I've been surprisingly lucky with theft. No idea why. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-19 13:54:17] - gah it's a bad week for petty theft. someone broke my sister's car window and took her laptop out of the back seat. someone broke my car window and took my laptop out of the trunk. someone went up into the rafters of my condo and stole my outdoor thermometer. i thought, nobody will actually steal this, will they? ~a
[2012-01-19 11:51:31] - a horse walks into a bar. several people get up and leave because they realize the potential danger of the situation
[2012-01-19 08:34:00] - "why does 73% of popvox users oppose protecting puppies" i read that as sarcastic. nina, were you being sarcastic? according to your friendly neighborhood political scientist, aaron is right, puppy mills are exempt. . . . and when i included the link i thought it was just a silly bill, not something that would actually cause unrest on the board. ~a
[2012-01-18 18:11:18] - nina: here's the summary, there's some comments from people opposing the bill on the page adrian linked but basically people are saying it cracks down on "hobby breeding" while doing nothing about large-scale substandard kennels run by bigger companies - aaron
[2012-01-18 18:09:26] - nina: reading the text of the bill, it sounds like it would crack down on people raising puppies in open places like farms, while allowing puppy mills to continue operating as long as they were exempted by a licensed veteranarian? i'm sure people are sympathetic to the goal, but it's just not a very good bill - aaron
[2012-01-18 17:53:52] - nina: Unfortunately I have to take that with a grain of salt. It was fun watching Rubio tear Charlie Crist apart, at least. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-18 17:40:02] - I'm sympathetic to the foreign copyright claim. Copyright is something that gets complicated when it crosses borders, which information does freely. That being said, the ruling is probably bad for precedent and not excellent for the long-term fight. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-18 16:34:33] - a: why does 73% of popvox users oppose protecting puppies? -nina
[2012-01-18 16:16:51] - a: most unfortunate. - mig
[2012-01-18 16:07:51] - xpovos: i've known marco rubio from his days in the florida house. like most florida legislators, he's a bit of a nut job, not unlike the rest of the republican candidates fielded this year. -nina
[2012-01-18 16:04:52] - thank you, scotus for doing this today of all fucking days. ~a
[2012-01-18 15:13:05] - http://pvox.co/zktAao to provide further protection for puppies ~a
[2012-01-18 14:27:41] - nina: I was unaware Marco Rubio was a co-sponsor of PIPA. That's... disturbing. He's been bandied widely as a possible VP choice. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-18 12:19:30] - well, it's working. Marco Rubio (a co-sponsor of PIPA) just pulled his support. also, his page seems to be down. -nina
[2012-01-18 12:13:34] - nina: thanks! more people following my lead: http://google.com/ http://en.wikipedia.org/ http://www.reddit.com/ http://washingtondc.craigslist.org/ http://imgur.com/ -title
[2012-01-18 12:09:04] - aaron: well one way of looking at it is they're accurately portraying how ineffective the law would be in preventing piracy. - mig
[2012-01-18 12:06:46] - title: way to get in on the action. -nina
[2012-01-18 11:48:28] - a lot of other websites i regularly visit are down today. i can see why people (who are trying to find distractions while they work!) are bothered enough to call congress about it. -nina
[2012-01-18 11:37:46] - Nina: ha, that was enjoyable
-Daniel[2012-01-18 11:34:52] - "all of my friends on capitol hill are complaining about the number of calls they are getting about SOPA and PIPA...it's 'almost as bad as health care reform' for the number of calls they are getting" thank you, wikipedia. ~a
[2012-01-18 10:21:28] - today's oatmeal is funny. http://theoatmeal.com/sopa -nina
[2012-01-18 10:01:34] - oh! i guess they're blacking out the pages using some kind of a script which is blocked by my FireFox "noscript" plugin... i feel guilty! - aaron
[2012-01-18 09:58:46] - aaron: yeah it's blacked out once I choose the English version on the splash page. it shows a page briefly then switches to the blackout screen - vinnie
[2012-01-18 09:56:59] - is wikipedia blacked out for anybody? i can still see it - aaron
[2012-01-18 00:43:58] - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_O1hM-k3aUY hercules misreads a stage direction as a line (audio needed) (also i laughed a LOT so maybe bad to watch at work) - aaron
[2012-01-17 17:57:09] - you are not wrong. however, if wikipedia tries to protect their interests at all costs, then it can lead to dangerous extremes. what if "protecting their interests" includes endorsing a political candidate? i actually agree with their decision, but i also understand the opposing viewpoint. ~a
[2012-01-17 17:52:59] - i think the way the current legislation is written, if one person on wikipedia posts something that's copyrighted, all of wikipedia goes down, not just that one page. am i wrong? -nina
[2012-01-17 17:52:08] - whether wikipedia is being political or not doesn't really matter, does it? at the end of the day, they're trying to protect their interests, which is to post information freely and publicly without any concerns of censorship or being sued or being forced to shut down. -nina
[2012-01-17 14:47:28] - Vinnie: Yeah, I thought it was a joke too. At first, I also thought the only lyrics changed were "Saint Elmo's" to "Tim Tebow's", but I guess he wasn't THAT lazy.
-Paul[2012-01-17 14:36:39] - mark warner too! yayyy - aaron
[2012-01-17 14:36:14] - paul: I thought Tim Tebow's Fire was a joke at first. apparently the singer just really likes the guy. if you listen closely, you can hear the original lyrics being sung by the backup vocals
apparently his love did not go so far as to re-record the backing vocals - vinnie[2012-01-17 14:35:55] - http://idealab.talkingpointsmemo.com/2012/01/obama-administration-comes-out-against-sopa-pipa.php i didn't expect the obama administration to come out against SOPA and PIPA... admittedly this is a very politically safe time to come out against a bill which is pretty unpopular among the public, but... still, respect - aaron
[2012-01-17 14:05:37] - http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nhl-puck-daddy/pass-fail-forest-face-creepiest-thing-nhl-ever-070124675.html was this like a fad or something that I just didn't notice? - mig
[2012-01-17 13:34:52] - this kind of decision is usually discussed on pages like this one. various open administrator boards and open arbitration committees are where these kinds of things are closed. ~a
[2012-01-17 13:31:17] - "who owns wikipedia" depends on which part of wikipedia you're talking about. the data is licensed under cc sa. the physical servers, domain names, etc are owned by the Wikimedia Foundation and final control is held by the board of trustees. ~a
[2012-01-17 12:42:57] - Aaron: Yup, just to be clear, I don't have any real concerns about wikipedia running this campaign, I just thought it was interesting that they're willing to take that chance on making such a public political statement since I'm sure there's plenty of people out there who would have an issue with it. -Paul
[2012-01-17 12:41:25] - xpovos: you can add holds though, so now I am on the waitlist for 10 books, which is the max number. There selection of sci-fi/fantasy is lacking but other sections seem to be better. ~g
[2012-01-17 12:22:43] - paul: yeah, i heard about someone leaving NPR recently because her husband was working on the 2012 Obama re-election campaign and she thought it would be unethical to continue working for NPR while he was campaigning. but she just resigned, firing someone is pretty aggressive, that's really unfortunate - aaron
[2012-01-17 12:22:10] - I think that it really opens up the question: who owns wikipedia. It's donation driven, both in terms of content and funding, but as much as it tries to be democracy cum anarchy it's still directed by one or a few individuals. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-17 12:21:26] - paul: i don't view it too differently from google recognizing namco's pac-man franchise on their main page, or ron paul's personal moral objections to abortion. in all three cases, i'm trusting it to keep their personal opinion separate from their responsibilities. but, we do that every day, whether they express their opinion or not - aaron
[2012-01-17 12:21:14] - Aaron: Yeah, I agree, which is why I don't have a problem with it. It reminds me of when Olbermann got fired for donating money to the Democratic Party (or whatever he donated money to), just because you have an opinion on something doesn't mean you can't try to be unbiased covering it. -Paul
[2012-01-17 12:17:35] - paul: i think there's a distinction between being an unbiased information source, and recognizing political issues with a blackout. i'd expect wikipedians to have an opinion of the bill, and i'd even expect it to be expressed on the web site. i just wouldn't expect it to be expressed in a biased way in one of their articles - aaron
[2012-01-17 12:10:11] - g: Exactly. Availability really kills the feature, making it more of a hassle than any possible value from, "Hey, free books!". I still check it out periodically, but they almost never have anything I want to read. And those times I do, the limitations of the system prohibit me, so I've not been successful yet. But that is with PWC, not Fairfax. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-17 11:45:52] - xpovos: do you use the public library lending feature on your ereader? I just went through and was very disappointed in the list of availabel books. ~g
[2012-01-17 11:25:57] - http://manila-paper.net/tim-tebows-fire-lyrics-st-elmos-fire-reworked-to-honor-tebow/23487 Has anybody else heard about the "Tim Tebow's Fire" remix of "Saint Elmo's Fire"? -Paul
[2012-01-17 11:21:47] - a: I don't particularly mind it (and do appreciate their efforts to raise awareness), I was just surprised by it because of how much wikipedia strives to appear as non-biased as possible. -Paul
[2012-01-17 11:04:40] - oh yes it is a very dangerous precedent. tons of wikipedians are very against this move. ~a
[2012-01-17 10:58:00] - mig: I agree that it only applies to the content of the articles, but it also seems like a potentially dangerous precedent. I think ideally you wouldn't have an organization that is supposed to be neutral taking stands on political issues at all. -Paul
[2012-01-17 10:53:45] - this morning, after posting the news i heard about sopa here, i heard this on dc101. "<paraphrasing>Wikipedia will be offline tomorrow. I'm not going to tell you why, though. You'll have to go there and find out why. We all need to learn what the government is doing right now because some day Wikipedia might be offline forever.</paraphrasing>" ~a
[2012-01-17 10:49:51] - yeah, agreed. they try to be neutral everywhere, but they try the hardest to be neutral in the article namespace. ~a
[2012-01-17 10:44:02] - paul: the neutrality concept only really applies to their content of their articles, as far as I know. So I don't really see a conflict with the blackout unless they unless they have a SOPA sucks article or something like that. - mig
[2012-01-17 10:36:55] - wikipedia doesn't have a sense of humor. if somebody makes a joke in a page, someone else will likely remove it eventually. ~a
[2012-01-17 10:31:49] - aaron: Neither could I. Sometimes wiki humor is very meta. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-17 10:27:29] - a: So would nuclear war, but I'm sure they aim to be non-biased there too.
-Paul[2012-01-17 10:27:25] - mig: pipa is still very much active. ~a
[2012-01-17 10:26:19] - "wikipedia makes such a big deal about trying not to be biased" except when it comes to topics that would completely and permanently destroy wikipedia? ~a
[2012-01-17 10:25:53] - Isn't SOPA pretty much dead right now though? Even though the WH didn't explicitly say it would veto it, saying it wouldn't support the bill probably was the kiss of death. - mig
[2012-01-17 10:21:30] - xpovos: i can't tell if that's a joke or not.... - aaron
[2012-01-17 10:10:15] - Paul: There's a Wikipedia page about Wikipedia's blackout protest. But it's being flagged for deletion... -- Xpovos
[2012-01-17 10:05:18] - Xpovos: Yeah, it's interesting because wikipedia makes such a big deal about trying not to be biased. What's the wikipedia article about SOPA going to be like now?
-Paul[2012-01-17 09:31:53] - a: That's a big deal. It's making MSM news as a result. That increases communication, as was discussed previously. I think it's worth the one-day annoyance here. It's tricky, though, because Wikipedia has to remain neutral on most political things. This works because it's a related field of politics. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-17 09:27:01] - a: thats cool, when is SOPA day? ~g
[2012-01-17 09:25:43] - wow, wikipedia is joining redit on sopa day. thoughts? ~a
[2012-01-17 00:56:19] - http://axecop.com/index.php/acepisodes/read/episode_37/ axe cop is a comic written by a 6-year-old kid, and illustrated by his 29-year-old older brother. it might be my favorite thing ever - aaron
[2012-01-16 11:34:12] - FN P90 . . . what a weirdly shaped weapon. ~a
[2012-01-13 15:28:32] - http://supercut.org/video/125 Everyone knows that women can't make coffee. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-13 13:52:50] - xpovos: yes, very well done.
~a[2012-01-13 13:46:06] - I gotta say I'm impressed by the use of the technology more than anything else. Creepily well done. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-13 12:59:33] - a: I guess that's one of the problems with universal assumptions. Nothing is really that universal in terms of knowledge. Another bit of data. Abel has a brother, Cain. Spoiler alert: Cain kills Abel and then is banished. Which given that the whole proto-family is already banished is saying something. This leaves you with just A&E again. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-13 12:44:12] - hmmm, the xkcd makes slightly more funny if you have this cultural foreknowledge: abel is one of eve's children. ~a
[2012-01-13 12:42:59] - understood. i could probably read the articles anyways. ~a
[2012-01-13 12:38:55] - a: I'm sure there's room for both of the studies to be true, in other words. -Paul
[2012-01-13 12:38:19] - a: I could probably find them, but I don't know if it would be helpful. The study your article linked to is fairly specific (women who changed jobs post-MBA), whereas I'm fairly sure the studies I've read about were more broad. -Paul
[2012-01-13 12:28:25] - hmmm. good question. well . . . lets go from the other direction. do you still have URLs for the studies and/or articles suggesting otherwise for me to read? ~a
[2012-01-13 12:17:49] - a: Ok... what are you suggesting, then? -Paul
[2012-01-13 12:08:57] - paul: obviously i'm not suggesting that you change your whole opinion on life because of one stupid study... ~a
[2012-01-13 12:04:11] - Sure, but that's a small sample size. If you went by the people I know, George W. Bush would've never been elected president.
-Paul[2012-01-13 11:55:01] - Paul: Eh, I always think its bull saying females dont ask for much... The females I know vs. the males I know I wouldnt say that the guys ask for more. But I could be wrong... ~g
[2012-01-13 11:52:19] - Xpovos: Sure, but I've still read about more studies for the opposite side than I have for this one, and it's not like those studies were from the 60s. -Paul
[2012-01-13 11:44:53] - Paul: At least with this one though, the amount of science on the other side is also limited, and the nature of the science, being social, is soft to start with. Physical science evidence changing is much harder to deal with, and much more likely to be a result of instrument error. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-13 11:30:18] - a: Refreshing or not, do you agree with what I'm saying, though? What if there was a study released tomorrow saying, "Oops, guess we were wrong about global warming all along." Would you change your mind about global warming or be cautious, knowing there is a lot of science on the other side. -Paul
[2012-01-13 11:24:20] - obviously i'm not suggesting that you change your whole opinion on life because of one stupid study, but it's still interesting data in my opinion. the ladies have a hard life and it's just *lazy* to blame them for their own problems. especially when that may not be even close to the truth. ~a
[2012-01-13 11:18:22] - paul: it's less refreshing to hear people say stuff like this. ~a
[2012-01-13 11:10:30] - That said I'm not sure what else you are supposed to put on air during half time of a sporting event. -Daniel
[2012-01-13 11:09:49] - Paul: Same, all half time shows pretty much bore me. They are a condensed less good version of sportscenter for whatever sport it is plus them repeating the same stuff that the in game announcers already said for the game in progress. -Daniel
[2012-01-13 11:05:04] - mig: Not sure, I watch some NBA games but I basically skip half time shows of pretty much all sports if I can. -Paul
[2012-01-13 11:03:15] - a: At this point, I think it's pretty unlikely that any single event is going to drastically change my opinion on much. It's not just because I am stubborn, but it's because I feel like I need to see a lot of evidence for a contrary opinion rather than just one data point. -Paul
[2012-01-13 11:00:52] - a: Awhile ago, I remember reading about some new study showing that second hand smoke didn't increase the chances of coming down with lung cancer (or something like that). I thought it was interesting, but frankly didn't really reconsider my stance on much because that single study seems to go against so many other studies indicating otherwise. -Paul
[2012-01-13 10:59:03] - a: I think the reason you don't hear it that often is because these kinds of studies often contradict previous (and more numerous) studies, and so it doesn't seem reasonable to totally re-evaluate based on just a single study. -Paul
[2012-01-13 10:56:33] - http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nba-ball-dont-lie/espn-left-studio-nba-show-223004443.html i'm just curious, because I hardly pay attention to the NBA (espeically on espn) during the regular season, but is the ESPN in-game coverage really this bad? - mig
[2012-01-13 10:51:58] - "If it's verifiably false (I'll want to see the actual study not a WaPo article on it) that will force me to reconsider some related theories" it's refreshing to hear people say stuff like this.
~a[2012-01-13 08:56:20] - In case people didnt see my post on facebook I am trying to help my niece sell girl scout cookies, Let me know if you want to order any. ~g
[2012-01-13 08:39:00] - a: Interesting article, I didn't have to use bugmenot. But on the article itself... I'll admit to having bought the "women don't ask" theory. It fit what I saw anecdotally at least, and made sense. If it's verifiably false (I'll want to see the actual study not a WaPo article on it) that will force me to reconsider some related theories. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-13 08:36:18] - It arrived that Saturday. Longer than Amazon's normal shipping, but hardly the three week delay they anticipated. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-13 08:35:54] - I left, refusing to buy anything that purchase. Wasted trip, but I can't conscience supporting immoral marketing techniques. Bought the same game at Amazon a week later when they dropped it to the same price on their own sale. But Amazon was worried they couldn't get it delivered until after Christmas. No biggie, I thought. I'll play it in the new year. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-13 08:34:34] - mig/Daniel: My last BBY experience was the After-Thanksgiving sales. They had a game I was interested in at a good price. In-store only. I went to the store and the sale was 'over'. Not quite bait-and-switch, but the ability to advertise a promotional price for something online and then end the sale so that no one can claim it is... not nice. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-12 16:30:31] - usually "needing something today" is probably the only reason i go to best buy. though i'm also a very impatient person. - mig
[2012-01-12 16:22:22] - Xpovos: Unless I need something today there isn't much reason to go there. And generally I don't need something today. I think the last thing I bought from Best Buy was a video card a couple of years ago when the one I had died and I had a WoW raid that night. -Daniel
[2012-01-12 16:12:47] - daniel: yeah sometimes they make you log in. ~a
[2012-01-12 15:57:56] - Whats wrong with your first wapo link? It works ok for me. -Daniel
[2012-01-12 15:57:35] - a: i was able to get to the article through the link just fine. Although i have had my own issues with the post from time to time. - mig
[2012-01-12 15:55:11] - washington post sucks, but i guess bugmenot will work. ~a
[2012-01-12 15:53:56] - piece of shit washington post. washingtonpost.com sucks major assage. ~a
[2012-01-12 15:48:56] - "Our latest findings should help us move past arguments that women themselves are to blame for the gender gap" ~a
[2012-01-12 15:06:28] - Daniel: Convenience of a local store? -- Xpovos
[2012-01-12 14:40:24] - I don't shop at Best Buy anymore. There isn't really any reason to shop there that I can think of. I don't trust them and think they are the same price or more on pretty much anything so why would you go there? -Daniel
[2012-01-12 14:01:11] - mig: I'm very not-fond of Best Buy, but I can't say it's because of any particular event. More just a series of mildly unpleasant ones? So nothing in that article surprised me. I'm already among the customers probably already lost permanently to Amazon. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-12 13:49:05] - then again, I do know someone who has sworn off ever going into a best buy again due to a customer service related debacle. - mig
[2012-01-12 13:36:04] - xpovos: interesting stuff. I frequent best buy a bit, but i rarely interact with the customer service, so a lot of these problems i'm usually oblvious to, but i'm not surprised they are there. - mig
[2012-01-12 13:28:05] - g: Yeah. There's clearly a lot wrong going on. I didn't delve deep enough to get to the bottom. The notion is stupid, as is the sign, and the fact that common sense has to be enforced. But then again, this is why lawyers make money. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-12 13:26:26] - Brutal article for Best Buy (BBY) http://money.msn.com/investing/why-best-buy-is-destined-to-fail-forbes.aspx?page=0 -- Xpovos
[2012-01-12 13:00:37] - Also the sign says "Public Swimming Pool" implying it isnt private and just for her personal use. ~g
[2012-01-12 12:59:27] - If part of her contract with her tenants is that they can use the pool and then discriminates and says only white guests can join the pool then it is discrimination. It is illegal for restaurants to deny service based on race and I would think the same would apply here. ~g
[2012-01-12 12:48:11] - Xpovos: But I think thats the distinction is that its not a public place its the pool in the yard of the duplex the lady owns. Though it probably can be seen from a public area (sidewalk) or some such. -Daniel
[2012-01-12 12:41:00] - Daniel: If I'm understanding the legal side of things correctly, yes. Or, at least a sign that's in a public area or could be seen from a public area. I imagine that in order to effectively discriminate the policy would have to be written down somewhere. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-12 12:36:15] - Xpovos: So its ok to have a white's only pool just not a sign that says so? I'm unaware of any laws that would prohibit the sign but its not really an area of expertise for me. -Daniel
[2012-01-12 12:28:27] - Daniel: Discrimination is one thing. The issue here, I think, is that it's a posted sign, making it public speech. They can argue that that's the best way to discriminate, which is probably true. But it's probably not protected speech, which means laws can be written, and probably are, to prohibit it. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-12 12:27:13] - I'm amused. http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/compost/post/is-ron-paul-right/2012/01/11/gIQAWgnTtP_blog.html -- Xpovos
[2012-01-12 12:17:42] - Is it illegal to have a whites only private pool? Dont the Boy Scouts have a no gay policy? I thought privately owned things could discriminate? Augusta (golf place) is no women still right? -Daniel
[2012-01-12 11:56:52] - It kind of sounds like the owner put the sign up as a sort of stupid joke or revenge act to get back at the guy for the alleged "slight" of the daughter's hair dyes or whatever mucking up the owner's pool, but I'm not sure based on just whats solely in the article. - mig
[2012-01-12 11:51:17] - a: hard to say whta aspect of the law is being broken with the sparse information here. Is the crux of the complaint that the owner was enforcing some sort of "whites only" ban with the sign (in which case I can see why there'd be a criminal complaint) or is the violation that the owner is being a major dickhole by placing the sing up? - mig
[2012-01-12 11:32:06] - what law is being broken? it's pretty clear to me that what she's doing is wrong, but i'm not 100% sure i understand the laws involved if this is a private residence. being a racist isn't a crime, being a horrible human isn't a crime. ~a
[2012-01-12 11:09:26] - I cant believe that the land lady actually thought that sign was acceptable... and thinks its acceptable enough to appeal the decision! ~g
[2012-01-12 11:07:16] - omg.... http://www.cnn.com/2012/01/12/us/us-whites-only-pool/index.html?eref=rss_crime&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+rss%2Fcnn_crime+%28RSS ~gurkie
[2012-01-12 00:50:42] - xpovos: booooo they censored it!!! i tried to show it to amy and it was all fuzzed out - aaron
[2012-01-11 16:30:29] - "Dr. Pepper? That's cute. Around here we drink 'the punch'." "Well, what's in it?" "Victory."
[2012-01-11 16:23:36] - well we're talking about it. we probably wouldn't be otherwise. they've already succeeded and the black-out hasn't even started? ~a
[2012-01-11 16:15:24] - a: not discounting that. Just wondering if it will only inform those who were already informed. - mig
[2012-01-11 16:08:18] - well you're assuming that it will only annoy. what if it also informs? ~a
[2012-01-11 15:40:09] - a: well, it's more annoying than doing nothing
yeah i think it's arguably worse than doing nothing - aaron[2012-01-11 15:20:35] - mig/aaron/xpovos: right, but from reddit's point of view, will it be any worse than doing nothing? ~a
[2012-01-11 15:06:29] - aaron: yeah that was something else I was thinking. It seems like in reddit doing this would be mostly preaching to the choir on the SOPA issue. - mig
[2012-01-11 15:01:24] - Oh, God! I've killed her. Quick... I need to flee to a country without extradition. Brazil? That should be safe. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-11 15:00:37] - yeah blacking out reddit won't matter because everybody who uses reddit already knows about SOPA. blacking out google or amazon might have an impact - aaron
[2012-01-11 14:58:51] - click the woman - aaron
[2012-01-11 14:47:20] - "I think it will annoy people but hopefully its also effective" will this effort be worth the annoyance if there is any impact on congress? ~a
[2012-01-11 14:33:48] - well yeah, I hope it's effective too, but I just wonder how many people will actually get the point vs. how many will just complain about the site being down. - mig
[2012-01-11 14:19:54] - mig: Well I think it will annoy people but hopefully its also effective. My news sources are pretty biased on this issue but I haven't heard anything positive about SOPA at all. The question will be if any other websites do the same thing. Reddit is one thing but google or facebook would be a whole other level. -Daniel
[2012-01-11 13:45:26] - bah, corrected link. - mig
[2012-01-11 13:44:56] - arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2012/01/reddit-going-dark-for-a-day-to-protest-sopa-online-censorship-bill.ars effective protest tactic or is it just going to end up annoying people? - mig
[2012-01-11 10:50:07] - Major props for training the hamster not to move. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GOMIBdM6N7Q -- Xpovos
[2012-01-10 14:01:48] - aaron: Or get dismembered. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-10 13:56:34] - a: happy 30th birthday, you're $6 more likely to die now in any given month! - aaron
[2012-01-10 13:26:56] - hehe. Oops, I'm costing my company money! ~a
[2012-01-10 13:26:53] - My coworker just received this voicemail: "... I'm calling regarding your group policy ... this is a basic life and disability policy, we just received your January premium at 292.25, there is a difference owed of $6.25. The monthly premium went up to $298.50 as of January. There was one employee that recently turned 30 and that person's monthly premium went up" ...
[2012-01-10 12:45:58] - http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2012/01/diablo-3-is-coming-to-consoles.ars Diablo 3 coming to consoles. I guess not a surprising development, but it brings a host of questsions. Will you be able to play cross platform? how is the RM-AH andl battle.net fit into a console version? - mig
[2012-01-10 11:59:04] - http://www.cityofmadison.com/incidentreports/incidentDetail.cfm?id=12902 man with unusual name arrested - aaron
[2012-01-10 11:46:40] - Huh... Dave made it up a bunch of times. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-10 10:09:36] - god, i always thought that "methinks" was a made up word. ~a
[2012-01-09 17:39:29] - a: oh! i did some graphical mockups for anti-satellite technology. it was one of the first projects i worked on, during my summer internships
obviously we painted it in a more positive light - aaron[2012-01-09 16:27:03] - a: But as it gets easier, it's easier to rebuild that kind of stuff. Also destroying even a near-earth orbiting satellite will generate substantial debris that will impact other satellites. A calculation will have to be made as to weather the harm of piracy outweighs the harm of potentially no satellite communication at all. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-09 16:23:45] - "there’s nothing really stopping it from blasting the satellites out of the sky either" right. ~a
[2012-01-09 16:22:54] - hopefully these hackers have considered the ease/difficulty of knocking a satellite from orbit. ~a
[2012-01-09 15:29:10] - Can't stop the signal, Mal. -- Mr. Universe
[2012-01-09 12:17:55] - aaron: this is (more or less) what i've already been doing to tell the difference. ~a
[2012-01-09 11:40:01] - http://i.imgur.com/0k8LN.jpg telling the difference between asian languages - aaron
[2012-01-06 11:34:48] - mig: airlines have already decreased the number of flights to europe to save money. i can see them making even fewer flights to guarantee full planes heading over there. prices will definitely go up. -nina
[2012-01-06 10:12:41] - Xpovos: Oo that does look cool, thanks for the heads up. -Daniel
[2012-01-06 09:59:33] - http://reason.com/blog/2012/01/06/the-first-climate-change-trade-war-break I'm not sure if anything will actually come out of this, but could be a bit of concerning news to anyone planning to take trips to Europe. - mig
[2012-01-06 09:48:33] - Today's Amazon free Android app (<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Splashtop">Splashtop</a.) looks interesting. Normal price is $5, so it's a big reduction at least. -- Xpovos
[2012-01-06 09:07:52] - a: You planning frisbee this weekend? -Paul
[2012-01-05 19:05:07] - http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/o3z47/what_is_a_time_your_pet_has_genuinely_surprised/c3e6n4a i guess this is what smart dogs do when they get sick of fetch - aaron
[2012-01-05 09:49:20] - mig: ahha that's really cool! great costumes and the audience seems like they loved it - aaron
[2012-01-04 15:59:37] - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wjf_lWxqyI star wars flash mobbers invade times square. - mig
[2012-01-04 15:10:22] - hah, that is a great story. ~a
[2012-01-04 14:23:07] - the gov't sent out an outlook meeting request related to a contract my company is working on, but didn't invite us... a few people from the DoD didn't understand why our company wasn't included in the meeting, so they invited us, three of our guys drove up to Maryland, yadda yadda... it was actually a surprise baby shower
- aaron[2012-01-04 12:43:49] - http://news.yahoo.com/elections/map/iowa/ for anybody else who hadn't seen the iowa caucus results, romney won with 24.6%, santorum a distant second with 24.5% with ron paul barely avoiding last place with you know, some percent idk - foxy
[2012-01-04 12:34:46] - http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/michele-bachmann-expected-quit-presidential-race-following-poor-161724564.html ah, official news. - mig
[2012-01-04 12:11:57] - a: seems like it, yes. - mig
[2012-01-04 12:06:10] - bachmann dropped out? ~a
[2012-01-04 10:24:24] - iou.dhs.org
[2012-01-04 10:14:10] - https://payments.amazon.com/sdui/sdui/index.htm did anybody else know about amazon payments? i always hated using paypal for accepting electronic payments and this seems like a really viable alternative - aaron
[2012-01-04 09:46:07] - And I for one welcome our Mitt Romney overlord.
[2012-01-03 16:24:32] - a: i mean on a practical level, not on a moral level
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