here are old message board entries

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[2004-06-04 13:00:02] - - travis

[2004-06-04 13:00:00] - paul: as you pointed out, both pacers and jazz had long playoff streaks

[2004-06-04 12:59:43] - Ok, you all are right. My bad. -Paul

[2004-06-04 12:59:29] - Paul: but if you think about it, their team probably has less loyalty to them than they have to their team a lot of times. Like they'll be traded or something to get rid of their salary etc, like travis said I think -dave

[2004-06-04 12:59:08] - Travis: No, I never said I didn't like anybody. I just said I respected Reggie more than Malone. And how exactly can you claim that Malone and Stockton and Reggie got drafted into a good situation? They never won. -Paul

[2004-06-04 12:59:00] - mig: both players did, they're only making like $1mil - travis

[2004-06-04 12:58:49] - Paul: I really do agree with you, that it stinks that players who have stuck with a team their whole life switch at the very end. -dave

[2004-06-04 12:58:43] - paul: would you be as upset with malone if he had left and wound up losing? - travis

[2004-06-04 12:58:34] - what about payton?  didn't he take less money to play in LA? - mig

[2004-06-04 12:57:25] - paul: all but one team a year "ends up losing at some point" - travis

[2004-06-04 12:57:24] - Paul: I think I like both players who have personality and stay with their teams, and players who are just flat out good. Like 'em for different reasons, but like em both all the same -dave

[2004-06-04 12:56:49] - why would that be smarter? - travis

[2004-06-04 12:56:43] - Paul: but I think you may be underestimating the power of the competitive spirit / drive to win / excel -dave

[2004-06-04 12:56:37] - so you basically only like players that get lucky enough to be drafted into a good situation: malone, stockton, reggie, bird - travis

[2004-06-04 12:56:29] - Travis: It would've been more noble (and smarter) if he had just agreed to play for less money. -Paul

[2004-06-04 12:56:04] - Travis: Oh, I didn't mean to imply that they were all tortured. Just that they all have been good enough to expect that they could go all the way but always end up losing at some point. -Paul

[2004-06-04 12:55:22] - Dave: You're right, it's not surprising. -Paul

[2004-06-04 12:55:12] - wasn't it more noble of malone to leave utah and free up all that cap space so they could get a bunch of good young players to build a future team from? - travis

[2004-06-04 12:55:05] - Travis: Webber and Ben Wallace were different because they didn't stay with the team for a long time and jump ship at the very end. -Paul

[2004-06-04 12:54:32] - Aaron: Such a random way to end that article too. -Paul

[2004-06-04 12:54:15] - only the red sox qualifies as a "tortured franchise" in that list of yours - travis

[2004-06-04 12:53:42] - Paul: I think it makes sense to like a team for things other than just winning. However, if you think about it, it's not that surprising to me that malone/payton would want to win at least one before they retire. -dave

[2004-06-04 12:52:44] - sometimes a great player just gets stuck in a bad team and i don't see anything wrong with him getting out and into a situation where he can actually play - travis

[2004-06-04 12:52:12] - how players like chris webber and ben wallace?  they got the hell out of washington and now look at them - travis

[2004-06-04 12:50:30] - http://www.cnn.com/2004/TECH/biztech/06/04/taiwan.heat.reut/index.html the last paragraph?! how does can you blister that part of your scrotum by using a laptop computer? - aaron

[2004-06-04 12:47:44] - Does that make any sense? -Paul

[2004-06-04 12:47:34] - Travis: So maybe your dad would agree with me since the Cubs are a tortured franchise too. I guess for me the journey is more exciting than the championship. Despite their failures, I still like the Pacers, Red Sox, Titans, Dolphins, Celtics (of late) etc. -Paul

[2004-06-04 12:46:43] - and the knicks have only won two championship, both in the early 70s - travis

[2004-06-04 12:42:51] - yankees is mainly a hold over from when i was like 6 years old and had no idea about any sports so the only teams i heard about were the yankees and the orioles, plus my grandfather liked the yankees (me) and the cubs (my dad) - travis

[2004-06-04 12:38:48] - Hell, a lot of my favorite teams are the ones who typically are good, but never win that championship. The only exceptions seem to be the Celtics (and that was awhile ago) and the Ravens (who only have won once). -paul

[2004-06-04 12:37:49] - Travis: I think it's the same reason why you like the Yankees and I don't. For you, it's all about winning a championship whereas I think other things are more important. -paul

[2004-06-04 12:36:43] - Travis: You could be playing for love of the game. Besides, wouldn't it feel a whole lot better if you won that ring with the team you have always played for instead of just jumping on another bandwagon? -Paul

[2004-06-04 12:36:28] - Paul: losers always whine about their best - connery

[2004-06-04 12:36:01] - mig/paul: yeah, that's why i didn't make that kind of statement, but the pacers might have always been better favorites to go further in the playoffs - travis

[2004-06-04 12:35:54] - Travis: Well, I guess that's the difference then. I don't attach as much respect to winning that actual ring as you seemingly do. To me, it's more respect worthy to stick with your team and do your best, even if it gets you no rings. -Paul

[2004-06-04 12:34:59] - but the whole point is to win that ring, otherwise you're just playing for money - travis

[2004-06-04 12:34:42] - Mig: The Jazz have been to the finals too, and actually had one of the longest streaks of making the playoffs in the NBA. -paul

[2004-06-04 12:34:14] - Travis: I have more respect for a guy who sticks with a team he has been with all his professional life than a guy who jumps ship in his waning years and joins a good team just so he can win a ring. -Paul

[2004-06-04 12:33:36] - seems like you should have more respect for a guy that uproots his entire life to go out and win so he doesn't have hear himself on all the "greatest players that never won it all" lists - travis

[2004-06-04 12:33:34] - The pacers however though have always been good enough to at least compete for a title most years. - mig

[2004-06-04 12:31:57] - so you'd have more respect for a guy that stays one more year just to lose? - travis

[2004-06-04 12:31:13] - well it's raining right now so hopefully it'll clear up by the time work gets out. - mig

[2004-06-04 12:31:07] - Paul: "[6-4-04 10:35:07a] - yeah, if it's raining just go to my place - travis" - travis

[2004-06-04 12:26:44] - Do we have a back-up plan if it does end up raining tonight? Are we going to Travis'? I brought along Angel just in case. -Paul

[2004-06-04 12:23:59] - I have tons of respect for T-Mac, I just don't like him as much. -Paul

[2004-06-04 12:23:44] - Travis: It's a little different if you do it while you are young and have not much time with a franchise. But with Malone being with the Jazz so long, it just seems different. -Paul

[2004-06-04 12:21:21] - Paul: i know i'd be happy for t-mac if he could get himself out of orlando and on to a good team (but you don't have much respect for t-mac anyway) - travis

[2004-06-04 12:19:39] - so you dislike a player who gets himself out of a bad situation (since the jazz were expected to be last this year) - travis

[2004-06-04 12:14:45] - Travis: Probably not. I was always a bigger fan of Stockton than Malone. I just kinda liked him by default since he was a big piece of a team I liked. I just have so much more respect for Reggie in sticking with the Pacers than Malone in ditching the Jazz. -Paul

[2004-06-04 12:13:13] - i have a feeling you wouldn't have turned on stockton if he had done the same thing as malone - travis

[2004-06-04 12:12:54] - but is there a reason you don't want him to win it? - travis

[2004-06-04 12:09:38] - Travis: I don't want him winning that 10th ring. -Paul

[2004-06-04 12:09:27] - Vinnie: That was a great show. Zelda was hot on the Friday Legend of Zelda episodes. -paul

[2004-06-04 12:08:49] - Mig: I liked him when he was with the Jazz. I dislike his quest to win a ring with the Lakers. -Paul

[2004-06-04 12:07:23] - and what's wrong with phil? - travis

[2004-06-04 12:06:47] - speaking of hard fouls, artest's flagrant on hamilton was kinda funny, cause he was looking at the ref as he elbowed him in the face - travis

[2004-06-04 12:06:30] - http://tv.yahooligans.yahoo.com/ I present for your viewing pleasure, the Super Mario Bros Super Show - vinnie

[2004-06-04 12:06:02] - malone bugs me more than kobe now, I think! so many flops and hard fouls - vinnie

[2004-06-04 12:05:31] - go devean george! - vinnie

[2004-06-04 12:05:27] - and it better not be kobe, shaq, championship 1, championship 2, championship 3 - travis

[2004-06-04 12:05:25] - Paul:  Don't like like Malone? - mig

[2004-06-04 12:03:15] - Travis: Phil. Kobe. Shaq. Malone. Payton. -Paul

[2004-06-04 11:59:21] - Paul: since nothing else is going on here, what are your "5 good reasons why I don't want the Lakers to win"? - travis

[2004-06-04 11:56:18] - Paul: but you must! - Bruckheimer

[2004-06-04 11:39:08] - Travis: Exactly. It's like a seal of approval. Bruckheimer liked this movie enough to fund it, so I must like it too! -Paul

[2004-06-04 11:38:06] - it's more like paul and bruckheimer like the same type of movies than bruckheimer actually making movies paul likes - travis

[2004-06-04 11:37:09] - and it's like the tiny toons jokes about steven spielberg, how much input does an executive producer really have on his projects?  he has some since he's paying for part of it - travis

[2004-06-04 11:35:50] - I also said that I don't THINK I've ever seen a bad one. So even if I saw Kangaroo Jack and didn't know it was by Bruckheimer, my statement is safe. -Paul

[2004-06-04 11:35:01] - Travis: I'm a wily one. -Paul

[2004-06-04 11:34:05] - hehe, vinnie's point is amusing, since it shows how paul narrowed down his grand statement - travis

[2004-06-04 11:32:05] - Paul: Yeah, I'll almost definitely see it if I can, I just don't have as high expectations for it, which could be good since it's easier to be pleasantly surprised that way -dave

[2004-06-04 11:29:38] - well, I guess you probably haven't seen it either, but god did it look bad - vinnie

[2004-06-04 11:29:10] - paul: Kangaroo Jack? - vinnie

[2004-06-04 11:09:33] - Dave: Well, the way I figure it's a Bruckheimer film and I don't think I've ever seen a bad one. -Paul

[2004-06-04 11:04:04] - the preview for the Arthur movie looks really good, but it's tough to do a good job with such a worn story -dave

[2004-06-04 11:03:52] - e

[2004-06-04 11:03:47] - paul: the quality of that picture isn't great and her hair looks kind of wacky - vinni

[2004-06-04 11:03:34] - Paul: no ^_^ -dave

[2004-06-04 11:02:19] - Is anybody else slightly freaked out by the fact that every shot of Kate Hudson in the Raising Helen ads shows her with a big smile on her face? -Paul

[2004-06-04 10:56:53] - Travis: http://kingarthur.movies.go.com/mainsite.html Strangely, she doesn't look as good in the bigger picture (IMHO). -Paul

[2004-06-04 10:54:03] - i haven't seen it but i'll concur since it's keira - travis

[2004-06-04 10:49:50] - I concur - vinnie

[2004-06-04 10:48:58] - Has anybody seen those King Arthur web banners with Keira in the middle with her bow and arrow? She looks good in that advertisement I think. -Paul

[2004-06-04 10:36:57] - Travis: Well, since I look like I'm still in High School, I doubt they would be terribly interested in me. -Paul

[2004-06-04 10:35:59] - "impress with your skillz" that works better - travis

[2004-06-04 10:35:41] - paul: i'm sure the high school wouldn't care plus there's high school girls to impress your skillz - travis

[2004-06-04 10:35:07] - yeah, if it's raining just go to my place - travis

[2004-06-04 10:30:54] - Travis: We should find an indoor court that we can somehow use for free. -Paul

[2004-06-04 10:28:30] - If it rains will we meet at your place? - aaron

[2004-06-04 10:25:33] - Paul: then we'll just have to utilize simulated basketball using advanced computer technology - travis

[2004-06-04 10:24:08] - Travis: But weather.com claims it's going to rain from like 4:00 until late tonight. -Paul

[2004-06-04 10:23:05] - travis: Don't worry about it - aaron

[2004-06-04 10:17:48] - aaron: you don't trust your driving instincts? - travis

[2004-06-04 10:16:19] - Paul: it's summer, it's always going to look like rain in late afternoon into evening - travis

[2004-06-04 10:09:31] - Travis: Since I was planning on meeting at the court anyway, that's fine with me. I might be late since I'll be coming straight from work but I should be there. Looks like it might rain though. -Paul

[2004-06-04 10:08:42] - Travis: Personally, I only thought women became hot when color was invented. -Paul

[2004-06-04 10:06:57] - travis: Wah! Can i just meet you at your place at like 5:45 then - aaron

[2004-06-04 10:06:21] - oh, heh, but the smiley was outside the (..) - travis

[2004-06-04 10:05:42] - vinnie: it's usually fairly harder to find good pics from back then - travis

[2004-06-04 10:04:26] - also, don't put the smilie after the sfw. I couldn't tell if you were being sarcastic - vinnie

[2004-06-04 10:04:19] - basketball people: since it seems to work out well and everyone knows how to get to the court i'm just gonna change the meeting place to the court instead of my place, but keep the 6pm time - travis

[2004-06-04 10:03:56] - travis: was there a doubt? - vinnie

[2004-06-04 10:03:23] - should there be effort grades as well? - vinnie

[2004-06-04 10:03:22] - http://www.imdb.com/Special/GalleryFeatures/bathing/bathing-19.html proof that even before color photos chicks could be hot (totally safe for work) - travis

[2004-06-04 10:01:32] - Since there are two ways to do poorly (being underweight and being overweight) and it would help to differentiate between which side a kid was on. -Paul

[2004-06-04 10:00:56] - Aaron: Well, I wasn't thinking that A would be the best grade. -Paul

[2004-06-04 09:57:48] - paul: Anorexic is the best grade? - aaron

[2004-06-04 09:57:16] - That way you have a sliding scale from Underweight -> Overweight -Paul

[2004-06-04 09:56:49] - Aaron: I think A should stand for Anorexic. -Paul

[2004-06-04 09:54:22] - C = Corpulent  D = Dangerously Obese - pierce

[2004-06-04 09:53:47] - a: Actually, I think I like that restriction since it eliminates the made up names we so often use once or twice that would otherwise clutter up the stats. -Paul

[2004-06-04 09:52:37] - a: So there can never be more than 2,000 people listed on the stats page? That seems restrictive - aaron

[2004-06-04 09:50:21] - A = Average weight B = Below average weight F = Fat - aaron

[2004-06-04 09:49:39] - I wonder if students are punished for being underweight too... Well it doesn't sound to me like these grades matter at all so i don't see why it's such a big deal - aaron

[2004-06-04 09:04:47] - Paul: exactly ^_^ -dave

[2004-06-04 08:57:53] - Dave: I wouldn't mind DDR camp as "punishment". -Paul

[2004-06-04 08:50:16] - Paul: The one's who fail should be sent to DDR camp ^_^ -dave

[2004-06-04 08:48:53] - http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,121735,00.html Students to Be Graded on Weight -Paul

[2004-06-04 08:48:16] - http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0602bee-protest02-ON.html Protesters decry English language's illogical spelling -Paul

[2004-06-04 08:21:11] - The Civil Rights record of the Commonwealth of Pessen: Excessive -Paul

[2004-06-03 20:35:31] - and fyi, i usually comment (ask pierce.  he's read the message board code).  ~a

[2004-06-03 20:27:19] - aba:  there, it's commented, are you happy?  ~a

[2004-06-03 20:25:05] - vinnie:  well most of it isn't perl.  ~a

[2004-06-03 20:22:29] - yeah, I can barely understand a bit of it, despite my childish teasing of pierce for not understanding it - vinnie

[2004-06-03 20:11:41] - if you were a good programmer you would comment your code.    -  aba

[2004-06-03 20:09:28] - it's so i can cut out people who are like never going to come visit this page EVER again, like josh and cryptic (among others)    ~a

[2004-06-03 20:09:22] - aba:  http://aporter.org/msg/statssh.txt  specifically  next if($_{$_}->[3]<5  which means if you haven't posted 5 posts in the last 10000 posts (not very hard at all to keep up; seriously, you're 1/5th of the way there) then your name gets cut out.

[2004-06-03 19:25:28] - i like how my stats are removed from the printout!  -  aba

[2004-06-03 17:34:25] - pierce:  oh you just said that.  ~a

[2004-06-03 17:09:08] - of course, because of a bug in the message board in 2000, there were no stats for april 2000.  so there is no "---".  ~a

[2004-06-03 17:07:52] - pierce:  re:  "---"  it's the summer.  may to july.  http://aporter.org/msg/statssh.txt  print "-"x3 if($'\'' =~ /^[47]-/)  ~a

[2004-06-03 16:54:03] - vinnie: no need to be a smartass... I didn't think it was that simple because there's no line after april of '00, for example.  You're right (now that I look at the code), but I was thrown off because it only does that if there are actually posts in those months. - pierce

[2004-06-03 16:52:31] - Travis: So he can find his next girlfriend. -Paul

[2004-06-03 16:52:18] - Aaron: EVERYWHERE. -Paul

[2004-06-03 16:52:17] - at least now we know why donald trump runs these contests - travis

[2004-06-03 16:51:36] - paul: Depends on where the cameras are - aaron

[2004-06-03 16:50:54] - Vinnie: It would probably get better ratings than the pagent itself. -Paul

[2004-06-03 16:50:33] - the dimple life - vinnie

[2004-06-03 16:50:17] - traul: it does sound like a reality show or something, doesn't it... - vinnie

[2004-06-03 16:47:38] - Travis: They're secretly taping the whole deal and the women are getting the proceeds from the sale of the video. -Paul

[2004-06-03 16:46:51] - pierce: fine. the lines show up after april and july. even I could figure that out - vinnie

[2004-06-03 16:45:47] - "Did that mirror just cough?" - Ms.Hawkins

[2004-06-03 16:44:40] - vinnie: if you want to get technical, I didn't tell you you couldn't tell me "I have the code". - pierce

[2004-06-03 16:44:27] - http://www.guardian.co.uk/worldlatest/story/0,1280,-4164438,00.html follow up on the japanese girl killing - travis

[2004-06-03 16:43:27] - why is forcing her to live with two girls a part of the prize? unless it's for guys across the world - travis

[2004-06-03 16:43:16] - (I didn't say "you have the code") - vinnie

[2004-06-03 16:42:56] - http://www.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,4057,9737614%255E13780,00.html "As part of the Miss Universe prize package, Ms Hawkins will spend the next 12 months living in a New York apartment with runner-up Shandi Finnessey (Miss USA), and Miss Teen USA" - travis

[2004-06-03 16:42:55] - pierce: RTFC - vinnie

[2004-06-03 16:41:30] - Pierce: I can't tell if you're mocking me or not. -Paul

[2004-06-03 16:39:47] - a: on the stats page, in the posts-by-month chart, what determines when two months are separated by "---"?  (and don't tell me "I have the code"). - pierce

[2004-06-03 16:38:43] - vinnie: but I'm not sure. - pierce

[2004-06-03 16:38:28] - vinnie: I think it's an informal term for the smaller ribs at the bottom (or rear, in the case of the animals whose baby-back ribs we actually eat). - pierce

[2004-06-03 16:34:36] - I only now realized how gross that sounds - vinnie

[2004-06-03 16:34:24] - why are they called baby back ribs again? - vinnie

[2004-06-03 16:33:23] - Paul: some tinfoil hat theorization for you... I bet the Chili's jingle was written by a divorced father who had been slighted by the biases in our custody law.  "I want my baby back, baby back, baby back..." - pierce

[2004-06-03 16:32:22] - they should! that means you're good - vinnie

[2004-06-03 16:31:55] - my toes hurt. - pierce

[2004-06-03 16:31:44] - heh.  yeah, I guess I didn't solve the "cartoon eyes" problem with ^^, did I? - pierce

[2004-06-03 16:31:44] - pierce: no, I think there's not enough. keeps programmers on their toes - vinnie

[2004-06-03 16:30:57] - also, it looks like cartman - vinnie

[2004-06-03 16:30:42] - I should be more specific... that's the last thing I need. - pierce

[2004-06-03 16:29:58] - vinnie: of course, the last thing we need is yet more coding conventions that can't be safely copied-and-pasted into an XML or HTML document. - pierce

[2004-06-03 16:28:38] - actually = accidentally - vinnie

[2004-06-03 16:28:21] - no I like >< better although I might actually type <> - vinnie

[2004-06-03 16:27:57] - Or hell, just use the words as operators, for pete's sake.  I almost never use && or || in perl, I almost always use "and", "or", etc because it's eight million times more readable. - pierce

[2004-06-03 16:27:00] - I think >< would be a better operator, since it looks like X.  Or you could preempt modulus and use % for xor, since % looks sorta like an X and it has little Os in it. - pierce

[2004-06-03 16:25:30] - Personally, I think ^ is a dumb operator for XOR, since it looks just like the mathematical symbol for boolean and, of all things. - pierce

[2004-06-03 16:22:43] - Dave: He's looking at you. -Paul

[2004-06-03 16:22:10] - a: they're just worried that geeks will put anime-eyes jokes in their code. - pierce

[2004-06-03 16:17:50] - a: complain to whoever makes the standards for those languages. - mig

[2004-06-03 16:14:31] - 80 hits since last post.  woo!  ok here's my huge rant:  perl, php, c++, java, c NONE of these languages (among others) have the ^^ operator defined (the logical xor, you know).  it makes me so mad that my vocabulary fails.  ~a

[2004-06-03 14:21:39] - Pierce: Ok. -Paul

[2004-06-03 14:19:41] - Paul: no, it was just a joke. - pierce

[2004-06-03 14:14:50] - Dave: Sorry -Paul

[2004-06-03 14:14:27] - Paul: no you may not ^_^ -dave

[2004-06-03 14:13:03] - Pierce: May I ask if your comment about me not supposed to be told something was a jab at me? -Paul

[2004-06-03 14:11:42] - Damn.  a: that comment was to you. - pierce

[2004-06-03 14:11:10] - Dave: oh, you're correct.  it does say that it allows admin access "even if it's disabled".  Wait, it is a nut. - pierce

[2004-06-03 14:10:48] - CHILLIES

[2004-06-03 14:09:51] - pierce:  oh i thought it was a bug.  maybe i misread.  i thought that people disabled it and it stayed enabled or something.  ~a

[2004-06-03 14:09:11] - Dave: yes, if you don't set up WEP (and technically, even if you do, but it's hard). - pierce

[2004-06-03 14:08:48] - dave:  yes.  at my apartment there are FIVE wireless access points that i can get free internet from.  ~a

[2004-06-03 14:08:37] - a: and I can see the undisableable admin access as a feature, albeit a dumb one.  But I'd bet a lot of people who would've been anal and disabled it have later found it very useful, and that's why Linksys left it always active. - pierce

[2004-06-03 14:07:55] - a: actually, since it's wireless router, theoretically your next door neighbor could leech your internet access with it. yes? -dave

[2004-06-03 14:06:44] - well, not a major bug (the not being able to disable admin access is annoying, but nothing to yell about)  ~a

[2004-06-03 14:06:34] - pierce: I don't remember either, somehow washpost just knows I've registered in the past, haven't ever had to type in user/pw a second time. -dave

[2004-06-03 14:06:29] - "Big security bugs are neither big nor security bugs... tawk amongst yuhselves" - LindaRichman

[2004-06-03 14:06:19] - dave:  yep.  i agree with you and pierce.  this is not a bug at all.  ~a

[2004-06-03 14:05:35] - a: like for homes networks etc, it's an inconvenience if they play with your router settings, but it doesn't seem like they can really benefit from it at all -dave

[2004-06-03 14:05:21] - So basically, this "big" security bug is neither big nor a bug, strictly speaking. - pierce

[2004-06-03 14:04:33] - Grrr!  I hate WP registration!  I can never remember what I registered for it with! - pierce

[2004-06-03 14:04:19] - a: I know that's not the point, I'm saying that the bug doesn't seem so bad even if they can guess your pw. -dave

[2004-06-03 14:04:11] - dave:  ALSO (less importantly) they can't get admin privileges even if they do have your password unless they have physical access to your network (which, granted, is much easier with wireless, but much more difficult than merely needing internet access)  ~a

[2004-06-03 14:03:49] - <!-- sarcasm -->

[2004-06-03 14:03:41] - http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A12296-2004Jun3.html CIA director resigns. Good? Bad? Indifferent? -dave

[2004-06-03 14:03:28] - <?sarcasm?> - pierce

[2004-06-03 14:03:15] - a: but it's clearly Cisco's fault that people choose easily-guessed passwords. - pierce

[2004-06-03 14:02:37] - dave:  that's not the point.  they can't get your admin previleges if you've set your password.  ~a

[2004-06-03 13:47:11] - well it's not a big deal since the workaround is relatively easy to do.  but usually people don't. - mig

[2004-06-03 13:46:35] - a: hmmm yeah, what can they do if they have admin privileges of your router? they could turn off you internet or whatever, but doesn't sound like they could get access of your computer -dave

[2004-06-03 13:41:49] - actually it doesn't seem like a big deal.  it doesn't look like a bug at all.  ~a

[2004-06-03 13:41:05] - thank heavens I don't have the wireless one -dave

[2004-06-03 13:39:05] - haha.  i don't have a linksys router . . . i only have the linksys access point and the linksys cable modem.  ~a

[2004-06-03 13:14:32] - http://www.internetnews.com/infra/article.php/3362321 big security bug in linksys router. - mig

[2004-06-03 11:46:27] - I vote for Lucrative Business Venture -dave

[2004-06-03 11:44:31] - To the shady business account. -Paul

[2004-06-03 11:44:16] - I move it be renamed then - vinnie

[2004-06-03 11:42:59] - Paul: it's being invested in a highly lucrative shady business ^_^ -dave

[2004-06-03 11:41:16] - Dave: I hope this fund is being invested in something then, rather than just sitting around in a non-interest bearing account. -Paul

[2004-06-03 11:39:46] - Paul: who said I had to use the fund right away? -dave

[2004-06-03 11:38:34] - Dave: Need a new car already? What's wrong with your old one? -Paul

[2004-06-03 11:36:22] - and donate 30k to the Dave's New Car fund -dave

[2004-06-03 11:33:01] - And say "There's no place like home. There's no place like home." -Paul

[2004-06-03 11:29:45] - Pierce: and you have to stand on your head and clap your feet in the air three times ^_^ -dave

[2004-06-03 11:23:18] - Pierce: Yeah, actually. It's me. I would tell you, but it can't be on the message board and you have to promise not to get mad at me AND you have to promise not to tell anybody else. -Paul

[2004-06-03 11:20:41] - did anyone ever answer what the title countdown is referring to? - pierce

[2004-06-03 10:58:57] - Paul: So yeah I would want abortion to be illegal because I think it's wrong, but I haven't been stumping around telling all of you guys that your beliefs in pro-choice are wrong -dave

[2004-06-03 10:58:36] - My bad, you're right. -Paul

[2004-06-03 10:57:51] - paul: oh, I misunderstood. I thought you meant forcing others to believe in the same ideals, not forcing others to practice the same actions. Like a ban on abortion wouldn't force everyone to believe abortion was bad, but it would make it illegal -dave

[2004-06-03 10:52:39] - Paul: yes, and if we were talking about the actions I've taken in my political career, that would be relevant.  But we're talking about the purely academic discussions we've had about the merits of public education. - pierce

[2004-06-03 10:45:20] - Pierce: Right, but you believe that public schools are good and you also believe in forcing that belief on others in the form of making them fund public schools. -Paul

[2004-06-03 10:41:12] - Public schools being the example, the decision was made that public schooling is "right", but the other options (homeschooling) aren't "wrong" inasmuch as you're still allowed to practice them if you wish, albeit within the context of supporting public schools with your tax dollars. - pierce

[2004-06-03 10:40:48] - Paul: But when you start taking things into practice, at some point you have to make the determination of a "right" or "wrong" belief, just so you know what you need to do. - pierce

[2004-06-03 10:38:51] - Paul: I am not a government representative, though.  My discussion of public schools, as an example, is merely academic since I am not the one "enforcing" it upon you.  Simply saying that I would enforce it goven the opportunity doesn't mean that that's what happens on this board. - pierce

[2004-06-03 10:30:03] - The fourth category i guess is pretty uncommon.... You hear a lot about like, die-hard vegans boycotting KFC and stuff, but i'm sure the opposite could be (can be?) just as forceful - aaron

[2004-06-03 10:27:31] - paul: Well with any belief like that, there's basically four categories... "I believe in making only the moral choice", "I believe in forcing everyone to make only the moral choice", "I believe in tolerating all possible choices", "I believe in forcing everybody to tolerate all possible choices" - aaron

[2004-06-03 10:25:36] - Or, perhaps more appropriately, Pierce would enforce on us all his belief that schools should be funded by everybody. -Paul

[2004-06-03 10:19:21] - Dave: Right, but sometimes our beliefs inherently require pushing them on others. For instance, you would enforce your "abortion is bad" belief on others, right? -Paul

[2004-06-03 10:18:47] - I realize of course that that may be a fine line / distinction since people may use the same methods to change someone else's beliefs -dave

[2004-06-03 10:18:17] - we get into plenty of heated discussions on the logical sense behind people's beliefs, but I personally don't really feel like people are actually trying to change the other's person's belief outright, just sort of discuss the validity of the reasoning. -dave

[2004-06-03 10:16:52] - ...reasoning steps are actually logical, and hence all our discussions. -dave

[2004-06-03 10:16:37] - Paul: and I honestly don't really think any of us really push everyone else to believe what we do. IMO, we're just curious as to each other's beliefs so we won't to logically understand why the other person believes so. Naturally, when the person is explaining their reasoning behind their beliefs, discussion arrises as to whether all the... -dave

[2004-06-03 10:14:42] - Paul: hmmm, I guess you're talking about political beliefs then? I was thinking more religious beliefs because of the preceeding discussion -dave

[2004-06-03 10:13:30] - Dave: Anybody who would use the law to enforce their beliefs. -Paul

[2004-06-03 10:12:40] - Vinnie: Probably. -Paul

[2004-06-03 10:12:04] - Dave: Hmmm, well, I think a lot of us do actually. -Paul

[2004-06-03 10:05:33] - paul: I'm not sure whether that makes us tolerant or just a bunch of cowards ^_^ -dave

[2004-06-03 10:04:41] - paul: actually, I can't think of many, if any people in our group who feel compelled to make others in our group subscribe to their beliefs -dave

[2004-06-03 10:03:48] - paul: so that's why you have so few friends! - vinnie

[2004-06-03 10:03:17] - I like people who loosely practice their politics and don't fel compelled to make others subscribe to their beliefs. -paul

[2004-06-03 10:01:29] - pierce: ahhh ok nm -dave

[2004-06-03 10:01:14] - pierce: yeah, the problem is, to know you're an agnostic, you have had to have looked into the matter somewhat, at least in order to discover the term -dave

[2004-06-03 10:01:07] - vinnie: yeah, I mean total agnostics, including those who don't know it or don't have a name for their beliefs. - pierce

[2004-06-03 10:00:34] - I like people who loosely practice their religion.  It shows that they can have a spiritual life without feeling compelled to make others subscribe to their beliefs. - pierce

[2004-06-03 10:00:05] - pierce: even the number of proclaimed agnostics I would guess is lower than the number of proclaimed homosexuals. could be wrong, but I thought even agnosticism was a bit fringey... (unless you mean agnostics that don't know it ) - vinnie

[2004-06-03 09:59:05] - I should clarify... few people are willing to associate themselves with so strong a disbelief.  There's (unfortunately, at times) no shortage of people who strongly believe something unproveable. - pierce

[2004-06-03 09:57:11] - Aaron: I think a more accurate comparison (based on your personal experiences) would be the proportion of gay people to the proportion of agnostics in our society.  Athiest, strictly speaking, means to actively believe in no god, and I think few people (gay or otherwise) are willing to associate themselves with so strong an opinion. - pierce

[2004-06-03 09:55:18] - I've heard it before so clearly you didn't make it up. I don't even care if it is made up. what does it apply to? - vinnie

[2004-06-03 09:42:27] - vinnie: Which 10% figure? The one i made up? - aaron

[2004-06-03 09:40:45] - sexuality affects us more than religion shocker! - vinnie

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