prev <-> next
[2014-09-24 12:40:41] - aaron: It's probably a little easier to be less biased after it was found out that the threat was a hoax. -Paul
[2014-09-24 12:40:12] - http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2014/09/24/how-serial-hoaxers-duped-the-internet-with-fake-4chan-threats-against-emma-watson/ The Washington Post also had an article on it, which I found later, for those who dislike Reason.
-Paul[2014-09-24 12:35:41] - a: oh, i meant reason.com did a better job describing the faux-chan incident than time.com, they were less biased and used accurate phrases like "following" instead of speculative phrases like "in response to" - aaron
[2014-09-24 12:34:13] - aaron, are you trying to be funny or charming? ~a
[2014-09-24 12:31:31] - paul: that's a much better article than the time article - aaron
[2014-09-24 11:22:44] - Thinking back on episodes of the Colbert Report where one of his interviewees came across as arrogant or creepy, I can totally see how it might've just been an attempt at being funny or charming. -Paul
[2014-09-24 11:21:53] - http://www.bloombergview.com/articles/2014-09-23/don-t-ever-appear-on-the-daily-show I thought #8 was really insightful: "Do not try to be funny or charming. Funny and charming usually reads “creepy and arrogant” on television, especially after the editors are done with it." -Paul
[2014-09-24 10:51:06] - I think also they probably were trying to figure out how for this new mmo to not compete with wow, and just couldn't come up with ways to make it "unique" enough. - mig
[2014-09-24 10:01:35] - I'm not terribly surprised. They had a sort of "reboot" of the titan project a year ago saying they weren't happy with how it was turning out, and I thought the project was kind of done at that point, especially now that hearthstone has kind of exploded and heroes looks like it might as well. - mig
[2014-09-24 09:37:48] - http://xkcd.com/1425/ Love today's xkcd. I find myself in this situation a lot as one of the few technical people in the marketing department.
-Paul[2014-09-24 09:35:17] - aaron: Huge deal, and you're right of course. People would've signed on for Titan and paid big bucks for it, even if it wasn't a great game. So this is a decision that I can see causing some friction with the Activision home office. But I liked the description that they gave acknowledging that they hadn't been able to find a way to make the MMO fun. -- Xpovos
[2014-09-24 09:32:36] - http://reason.com/blog/2014/09/24/emma-watson-photo-leak-was-hoax And apparently even the nude photo leak threat was more of a prank than anything else... -Paul
[2014-09-24 09:02:46] - xpovos: wow that's a huge deal! i'm surprised that not only did they cancel titan, they said they're not really interested in making any MMO right now.... that's nuts! i think a lot of people would love a new MMO from blizzard - aaron
[2014-09-23 21:57:11] - Whelp.... http://www.polygon.com/2014/9/23/6833953/blizzard-cancels-titan-next-gen-mmo-pc -- Xpovos
[2014-09-23 13:59:03] - aaron: I didn't even think about the fact that the 4chan users might not be male. I was just miffed that they ignored the actions of thousands for the actions of hundreds (at most?). -Paul
[2014-09-23 13:34:03] - paul: for all they know it was just one girl who was really pissed off that her male friends were obsessed with emma watson and wanted to teach her a lesson. statistically, yeah, it's probably men, but it's still inept and offensive to assume that - aaron
[2014-09-23 13:33:14] - paul: yeah that headline is terrible, it may have well have said, "Emma Watson asked men to support women, and here's how six Supreme Court Justices responded", since they're just taking a wild guess that, "you know, it's 4chan, it's probably men, and they're probably responding to this speech" - aaron
[2014-09-23 13:29:02] - mig: http://reason.com/blog/2014/09/19/david-harsanyi-on-joe-bidens-latest Your Harry Reid link reminds me of this. Frankly, I don't think Biden's comment was that big of a deal, but I do wish Democrats were held to the same standards as Republicans in terms of saying offensive things. -Paul
[2014-09-23 13:24:58] - "Emma Watson Asked Men to Support Women And Here’s How They Responded" is the headline, in case it gets changed. Even by the article's own admission, tens of thousands of men have signed on in support and yet the headline instead wants to focus on whatever handful of 4chan users are being jerks about it. -Paul
[2014-09-23 13:23:18] - http://time.com/3421898/emma-watson-4chan-feminist-un-speech/ I feel like this is somewhat related to some of the gender related things we've been talking about recently, but the headline to this article is a great example of some of the men-bashing (for lack of a better term) that irks me. -Paul
[2014-09-23 11:55:06] - and honestly, I feel most of the grandstanding talking heads like Bob Costas and some other writers who have been ranting about the name in sports media recently fall into this boat as well. The controversy isn't any secret in these circles and it's quite odd they've all suddenly discovered their outrage. - mig
[2014-09-23 11:48:47] - Harry Reid, specifically, is a bit of a hypocrite when it comes to issues of racial sensitivity. - mig
[2014-09-23 11:46:31] - a: democrats in congress. - mig
[2014-09-23 11:30:20] - who is doing that? who thinks this is a cool cause to latch onto? ~a
[2014-09-23 09:50:00] - I think they should just change the name to just get it over with since it does seem inevitable at this point given public opinion, and some of the defenses that the team has brought up are just plain sad. What annoys me about the whole thing though is people who don't really care about the name but just want some "cool" cause to latch on to (e.g. Harry Reid). - mig
[2014-09-22 17:44:31] - a: *Sigh* Sorry. As I was writing it, I thought we had discussed it, but I went ahead anyway. I'm getting old with a bad memory. -Paul
[2014-09-22 17:28:46] - redkins+name. it looks like we talked about the name change in 2006 and twice in 2014
~a[2014-09-22 17:25:10] - paul: the tipping point seemed to be when the USPTO revoked their trademark. anyways, we have already talked about the name a little. the Notre Dame Fighting Irish seems pretty horrible ~a
[2014-09-22 16:52:02] - Speaking of which, do the message board denizens have an official position on the Redskins name? Offensive? No big deal? I personally don't care much about the name debate, but it does seem like a tipping point might be fast approaching. -Paul
[2014-09-22 16:49:25] - a: The dialog from Snyder and RG3 where they are supposed to sound like the native american side which are against the name seemed forced. I don't think in real life anybody would call it offensive or derogatory if somebody else named their organization the Redskins. -Paul
[2014-09-22 16:42:01] - paul: i'm not sure how it fits either. I guess he just did some unrelated journalism no-nos it looks like. - mig
[2014-09-22 16:41:13] - a: /shrug, all the TDS bits I've seen usually just involve letting the targets just talk themselves into embarrassment, but like I said, I'm just going by what admittadly little of the show I watch. - mig
[2014-09-22 16:23:46] - how so? ~a
[2014-09-22 16:12:24] - a: I did see it. Pretty clever (with the patent thing), although I wish the metaphor fit a little better. -Paul
[2014-09-22 15:38:28] - hopefully you guys saw the teaser for the new south park? "go fund yourself" on sept 24th. ~a
[2014-09-22 15:35:09] - mig: "quite another to force an awkward confrontation like they did here" do you even watch the daily show? they (and colbert) love awkward confrontations. ~a
[2014-09-22 15:25:38] - http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2014/09/addressing-allegations-of-collusion-among-gaming-journalists/#p3 I have no idea how this fits into the GamerGate thing, but ArsTechnica had a short article about how one of their people was involved. -Paul
[2014-09-22 15:14:59] - mig: Maybe. I don't watch TDS at all (can't even find time for the Colbert Report and Independents), but it seems like forcing awkward confrontations would be something right up their alley. Wouldn't they love to drop a homophobe into a gay rights parade? -Paul
[2014-09-22 15:12:00] - but yeah i'm not sure why anyone in their right mind would agree to show up on TDS on this subject. - mig
[2014-09-22 15:10:09] - I just think it was a weird approach for TDS to take because I'm not sure they've done something like that before with interview subjects (though I'll admit I don't watch it often enough so I could be wrong). Usually they just let the interviewees just embarrass themselves, but it seemed like they just wanted to humiliate the fans pretty overtly. - mig
[2014-09-22 15:00:58] - paul: sure enough. I do think it's one thing though to let the fans say their piece and make them look foolish afterword, and quite another to force an awkward confrontation like they did here. - mig
[2014-09-22 14:52:06] - mig: I have a hard time being sympathetic to people who willingly go on the Daily Show, knowing that they're going to be mocked. Obviously I haven't seen the clip, though... -Paul
[2014-09-22 14:23:55] - http://time.com/3408519/daily-show-native-americans-redskins/ TDS "ambushes" redskins fans with Native American activists. Fair or fowl? Though from the description in the article, I don't think it'll be a very funny segment if/when it does air. - mig
[2014-09-22 09:18:20] - xpovos:
- aaron[2014-09-21 18:49:43] - xpovos: That's the joke - mcbain
[2014-09-20 17:15:36] - aaron: What the fuck did I just watch? I'm even more confused about this than "Green is not a creative color". -- Xpovos
[2014-09-19 13:38:47] - http://www.clickhole.com/video/if-you-dont-think-you-have-any-racial-prejudices-y-1026 if you don't think you have any racial prejudices, you better watch this video - aaron
[2014-09-19 12:49:08] - http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11322617 -- Xpovos
[2014-09-18 11:52:24] - mig: that's all well and good, until the first user asks to reset their password. then 1000 more users ask to reset their passwords. apple has a plan for this? ~a
[2014-09-18 11:14:48] - http://arstechnica.com/apple/2014/09/apple-expands-data-encryption-under-ios-8-making-handover-to-cops-moot/ supposadly apple will make it so they can't turn over user data to the government, even if thy wanted to. - mig
[2014-09-18 11:13:17] - a group photo was used to identify people who carried out a brutal beating in philadelphia on sept 11th: a disgusting story. still no word of an arrest but the cop (on twitter?) seems hopeful. ~a
[2014-09-17 15:57:37] - a: damn, that goes along with this statistic i read about where bearded men are more likely to be judged guilty by mock juries. poor guy doesn't stand a chance with his scruff beard and scary tattoo - aaron
[2014-09-17 15:55:31] - http://i.imgur.com/aDveYo3.jpg too cool to do drugs - aaron
[2014-09-17 15:26:13] - (a little bit old) here's an article about an accused murderer wants his "murder" tattoo removed, because, of course, it might have adverse affects on his trial. ~a
[2014-09-17 15:00:39] - a: http://tylervigen.com/about the comic on this page was my favorite part of that web site - aaron
[2014-09-17 14:39:24] - omg this is awesome. spurious correlation: divorce rate in maine = per capita consumption of margarine. ~a
[2014-09-15 09:54:18] - a: I'm not sure why there needs to be a connection to Kotaku, specifically in any of these discussion pieces, since we are talking about general issues in the gaming industry. But, if you must have your Kotaku connection, TB does mention Nathan Grayson as the inteviewer instigating the incident with moba female characters, who is a writer for Kotaku. - mig
[2014-09-15 08:52:49] - to everyones surprise, i watched the whole thing (the 30 minutes one). it was all pretty general pro-free-speech i'm-a-guy-talking-about-women-problems stuff. i didn't disagree with a word of it, but i am also not sure what this has to do with kotaku. ~a
[2014-09-14 11:21:57] - a: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e78JRIHRjC0 lengthy (30 mins), but talks about some of these game industry issues. Again, you can talk about this without dragging Quinn's personal life into it. - mig
[2014-09-12 18:27:47] - http://themundanematt.tumblr.com/post/95428752119/dmca-notice-and-removal there is also an issue of quinn allegedly issuing DMCA take downs of critical videos that use footage of her game. It's possible that someone could be impersonating her to do this, but it wouldn't be the first time an indie developer has abused dmca notices to silence critics. - mig
[2014-09-12 18:09:01] - bah, your parser! http://www.polygon.com/2014/3/19/5526114/developer-zoe-quinn-offers-real-world-advice-support-for-dealing-with - mig
[2014-09-12 18:08:14] - a: http://www.polygon.com/2014/3/19/5526114/developer-zoe-quinn-offers-real-world-advice-support-for-dealing-with, http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/sep/01/how-to-attack-a-woman-who-works-in-video-games disclosures at the bottom, but were appended afterwords. - mig
[2014-09-12 17:20:57] - http://reason.com/24-7/2014/09/12/somebody-tell-kerry-white-house-says-wer Funny, I must've missed the congressional vote... -Paul
[2014-09-12 12:27:42] - so there's no specific article? ~a
[2014-09-12 12:26:22] - kotaku, polygon, the escapist (video mentions that they will be revising their own policies regarding COI), possibly arstecnica, among others. Again, you personally may not think this whole COI thing is a big deal, but lots of outlet policies are changing as a result of this because others think it is a big deal. - mig
[2014-09-12 12:20:56] - yeah. kotaku? they're who we're talking about? which article exactly should they have put a COI warning onto? ~a
[2014-09-12 12:20:25] - I mean, the the video was able to highlight most of the issues regarding gamergate without even mentioning quinn once. - mig
[2014-09-12 12:17:19] - the whole thing with quinn was sort of a catalyst for this shitstorm, but I believe it is no longer the focal point, and seems to only be brought up by journalists who just want the furor to go away. - mig
[2014-09-12 12:12:21] - a: as i've been saying before. this whole gamer gate thing is no longer about quinn anymore. - mig
[2014-09-12 11:54:19] - a: I saw that image yesterday. I smiled, but at the same time it made me preemptively annoyed, because it sounds like Apple is already getting attention for some of their "revolutionary" changes that android has had for years. -Paul
[2014-09-12 11:15:08] - iphone 6. i'm in an imgur mood apparently. ~a
[2014-09-12 10:36:15] - mig: i watched the escapist video and i'm still not sure what quinn did wrong or why i should care. (all of me thinks that we're only talking about journalism ethics to somehow make it ok that we're also talking about quinn's private life). unless i missed some fact, she didn't do anything unethical in her professional life. ~a
[2014-09-12 10:09:16] - http://www.politico.com/story/2014/09/senate-block-campaign-finance-amendment-110864.html the political speech censorship amendment fails. - mig
[2014-09-12 07:57:23] - apple pay. ~a
[2014-09-11 18:41:22] - and there's a reason these disclosures are pretty much standard in the general journalism industry. - mig
[2014-09-11 18:40:52] - basically the gist of it is sort of what paul is saying. There's nothing necessarily wrong with what Zoe Quinn may or may not have done, but because media outlets were not being open about certain things, it leads to the perception that there was. you may not personally care, but others do. - mig
[2014-09-11 18:34:33] - a: http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/jimquisition/9711-On-Game-Journalism-Corruption maybe this explains my point a little more? - mig
[2014-09-11 17:10:36] - a: Not necessarily because you can't sleep with her, but because you're keeping it a secret, which makes people think there is something wrong with it. Does that make sense? -Paul
[2014-09-11 17:09:48] - a: It's like, if you were secretly sleeping with Hilary Clinton, and had a job on cable news pontificating about congressional politics... I think it would be considered a little scandalous (and not just because she is old enough to be your mother) even though you weren't directly covering her. -Paul
[2014-09-11 17:03:32] - a: he wasn't reviewing her games. Even if 99% of people felt like that was harmless, the fact that Kotaku then proceeded to try to cover those things up might make those 99% think there might be something to it. -Paul
[2014-09-11 17:02:42] - a: This is a complete guess (I'm about as in the dark to this issue as you are), but maybe it has something to do with journalistic disclosures. Just like how journalists are supposed to disclose any potential sources of bias in their reporting, it could be see as a potential source of bias if a game reviewer was sleeping with a game developer even if... -Paul
[2014-09-11 16:59:56] - i mean, i'll admit, i'm not very knowledgeable about who this woman is and the possible horrible things she's done (the issue gets even more complicated when i hear people saying she doxed herself), but most of the things i've heard you and aaron tell me are things i'd rather not had known. unless i'm missing something! did she actually do something wrong? ~a
[2014-09-11 16:56:57] - mig: what cover up? how did they act? if quinn did nothing wrong then there is no wrongdoing to cover up. this is none of my business. i see no need for kotaku to mention anything to me. and if reddit decides they want to moderate their boards to remove illegal/unwanted material, i see no cover up their either. ~a
[2014-09-11 15:58:48] - a: I really don't think that this is about Zoe Quinn at this point, but more about how the journalistic entities involved have been acting. There's a saying w/ regard to sports scandals that the cover up is worse than the actual alleged crime, and that may be the case here. - mig
[2014-09-11 15:51:41] - I heard somebody on the radio say they didn't currently have internet at home because they had to keep their Wizards season tickets. I know I probably value internet more than the average person, but that still shocked the hell out of me. -Paul
[2014-09-11 14:37:45] - a: anyway i didn't mean to come off as like, attacking her, or defending her ex or whatever. but the wired article is written to sound like, "here's this thing that 4chan made up about this girl" when it's more like, "here's this thing that PETA made up about michael vick" -- well yeah okay, that's kind of bad i guess. why should i care again? - aaron
[2014-09-11 14:31:44] - a: so i guess you have people who are like, "whoa, someone slept with a journalist? and THEN they deleted all these messages saying that it happened? i didn't know they did either of those things!" and it's a big deal to them... i mean i guess it's why some editorials start with meaningless notices like "Fox Conn is a subsidiary of Little Debbie" or whatever - aaron
[2014-09-11 14:27:22] - a: yeah exactly, it's not really a big deal, except for the fact that sites like kotaku, reddit, escapist, and other sites were deleting all threads which mentioned zoe quinn, preventing people from talking about it. streisand effect x 1,000 - aaron
[2014-09-11 14:21:00] - and then anybody with half a brain cell would realize, "well no, it makes total sense that people in the gaming industry would have a lot in common and date, it would be like two surgeons dating. why do i care as long as he's not reviewing her game" - aaron
[2014-09-11 14:19:50] - i still don't see the part where she did anything wrong or why this is anybodies business. so what if she was sleeping with her married boss? none of my business. so what if she was sleeping with a reporter if the reporter wasn't reviewing her games anymore. none of my business. so what if she was dating this dick eron? i'm not even sure what kotaku did wrong. ~a
[2014-09-11 14:19:19] - like even this wired article just mentions an "alleged relationship... with a gaming journalist who works for Kotaku", as though it's some unconfirmed rumor, when they could have just as easily printed, "Zoe Quinn is currently in a relationship with a gaming journalist at Kotaku", which might actually make people realize -- wait what?? that's a little fishy... - aaron
[2014-09-11 13:52:21] - overall i think it sounds like more of a personal issue than a professional issue, it seems 100% confirmed that she was sleeping with her married boss joshua boggs and a kotaku reporter at the same time she was dating this other guy eron. and i think people were upset that sites like kotaku weren't more up front about it - aaron
[2014-09-11 13:49:34] - a: http://kotaku.com/in-recent-days-ive-been-asked-several-times-about-a-pos-1624707346 yeah, "nathan grayson" is one of the five guys her ex mentioned, which kotaku confirmed. nathan hadn't reviewed zoe quinn's game but she was mentioned in his articles - aaron
[2014-09-11 13:04:48] - GamerGate. "Kotaku editor-in-chief Stephen Totillo stated that the writer had not written anything about Quinn after beginning the relationship and had never reviewed her games." ~a
[2014-09-11 13:03:09] - aaron: "he said/shut up" you keep going back to that. i'm fine with "he said/shut up" as long as what he's saying is moronic. it seems like mostly what he is saying is moronic? i'm having a hard time figuring out 1) what quinn has done wrong and 2) the evidence that it's true. your wall of text and your blog link both confuse me. ~a
[2014-09-11 12:52:41] - oddly, the one case where there's any kind of "he said she said" is the doxxing, where zoe says she was doxxed, and other people say there's evidence she doxxed herself. which is especially weird. but all the other arguments are just a "he said/shut up" thing - aaron
[2014-09-11 12:49:29] - a: honestly i don't know, my first exposure to the blog and its actual evidence is just now, because you asked about it. in general, i've just been reading summaries of the arguments/counterarguments and going off that. which is awkward because, there's no counterarguments, except for one case - aaron
[2014-09-11 12:47:46] - paul: i like the idea of being able to play 1-player versus the AI. i've probably played about 1,500 games of Race For The Galaxy against AI, about 100 games of Kingdom Builder, and maybe 20 games of Space Alert. single player board gaming really appeals to me, it's like a puzzle - aaron
[2014-09-11 12:44:27] - *eron ~a
[2014-09-11 12:40:03] - aaron: is enron the journalist that gave a good review? ~a
[2014-09-11 12:38:44] - aaron: That's pretty neat (Galaxy Trucker on iPad). Not sure if I would bother with it over the board game, but I guess it beats lugging the big box around if on vacation or something. -Paul
[2014-09-11 12:31:33] - a: he posted giant wall of text chat logs on his blog (that's just one of eight) which, yeah maybe he could have doctored it but it would have been a lot of trouble, and she didn't refute it anyways - aaron
[2014-09-11 12:21:30] - aaron: what evidence did party a provide? according to wired (i keep pointing to this article, because it's literally the only thing i've read on the matter) party a only provided shitty evidence. ~a
[2014-09-11 12:10:40] - Maybe bribery is a bad example, since it would be relevant, but other stuff that shouldn't be relevant to a political campaign. -Paul
[2014-09-11 12:10:03] - aaron: I'm a little sympathetic to her line of reasoning. I had always thought that if I ever decided to run for any political office, and there were accusations of something untrue (an affair, bribery, etc), I would try to take the moral high road about not responding to smears, while also realizing such an approach almost never works. -Paul
[2014-09-11 12:04:49] - honestly, that kotaku, even with its not so great reputation, had to publicly spell out to its writers that doing this was definitely not ok, was pretty stunning. - mig
[2014-09-11 12:03:03] - a: even if we assume the allegations of sleeping around are false, there are other issues, such as gaming journalists providing positive coverage about her while simultaneously sending her donations without any sort of disclosure. Even with disclosure, it's on pretty shaky ethical ground. - mig
[2014-09-11 12:03:01] - a: this is her official response supposedly, she's not really refuting that any of it happened she's just saying "don't talk about it please" - aaron
[2014-09-11 11:57:19] - a: the difficult thing about trying to figure out what really happened, is that this isn't a case where party A provides evidence one way, and party B provides evidence the other way. this is a case where party A provides evidence one way, and party B tries to get everyone to delete all of the evidence - aaron
[2014-09-11 11:52:26] - aaron: well unless some of the facts in the making up weren't completely correct. according to wired, quinn didn't necessarily sleep with anybody, or necessarily sleep with anybody for the given reasons. that's different than making up occupy wall street. ~a
[2014-09-11 11:43:52] - a: the zoe quinn thing wasn't "made up" as in it didn't happen, it was "made up" in the same way something like "occupy wall street" was made up. something based somewhat in fact, that a lot of people decided to rally behind and call attention to - aaron
[2014-09-11 11:37:53] - the turn-based mode means you can play multiplayer using only one tablet, but there's also an online real-time mode if you all have tablets - aaron
[2014-09-11 11:37:22] - paul: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cIXd9RHdZDc 14-minute video (augh) showing how galaxy trucker works on the iPad, but if you want to skip to the interesting parts, 3:10 shows him building a ship in real time, and 10:45 shows him building it in a turn-based mode - aaron
[2014-09-11 11:34:37] - http://gizmodo.com/while-you-werent-looking-dell-announced-the-worlds-mos-1632621335 android tablet with a weird 3d photograph feature... overall looks like a really cool tablet - aaron
[2014-09-11 10:58:37] - mig: Personally, I kind of resent the implication that that all men are at fault for this (and a host of other "anti-women" crimes). Heck, there was even a backlash against the #NotAllMen hashtag because apparently pointing out that NOT all men rape/harass/are jerks is wrong. -Paul
[2014-09-11 10:57:26] - a: http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/2011/10/21/president-obama-has-ended-war-iraq I have no idea where I would've gotten that idea. -Paul
[2014-09-11 10:36:49] - paul: "most recent undeclared war by our nobel-peace-prize winning constitutional scholar president is a mistake?" wow, i didn't know that bush 43 won the nobel peace prize. or that he was a constitutional scholar. i guess you're implying that the 2003 undeclared iraq war actually ended? ~a
[2014-09-11 10:16:37] - I am genuinely curious what the hell happened between TechRaptor and reddit. It was either a false positive auto ban (which can happen) or something really shady is going on. - mig
[2014-09-11 10:07:57] - And the tendency from these people to just shut off debate. Any legitimate criticism of Anita Sarkeesian, for instance, is just shouted down by these people saying that any criticism is basically condoning all the unsavory harassment she has been dealing with. - mig
[2014-09-11 09:59:13] - xpovos: though the brietbart article does highlight several of my own annoyances with some gaming journalists. The constant finger-wagging about how all gamer males are the worst people on the planet is getting rather tiring. - mig
[2014-09-11 09:53:09] - xpovos: honestly, I do follow game industry news fairly closely but this flew under my radar. - mig
[2014-09-11 09:51:11] - I'm still confused. Is gamergate specifically about Zoe Quinn herself or just the general issue of improper relationships between reviewers and publishers? - mig
[2014-09-11 09:38:56] - So, can we all agree that our most recent undeclared war by our nobel-peace-prize winning constitutional scholar president is a mistake? Or are there people here who think that this is a good idea and having four presidents in a row (spanning 25+ years) bombing Iraq isn't excessive?
-Paul[2014-09-10 17:25:50] - a: And then apparently it became a big issue because said female game developer got harassed and it somehow turned into an issue about how gamers are too misogynistic (or something). -Paul
[2014-09-10 17:25:01] - a: I feel like I only know half the story, but I think it has to do with accusations (possibly from an ex-boyfriend) that a female game developer slept with journalists to get good reviews for her game. -Paul
[2014-09-10 16:51:05] - yeah i don't know the story. wtf is gamergate? according to wired, it's made up? how 4chan manufactured the #gamergate controversy. i still don't know what the original controversy was though. ~a
[2014-09-10 16:40:00] - Xpovos: I have been pretty successfully ignoring that whole thing (to the point where I had to look up what GamerGate meant). Probably helps that I am playing so few video games right now. -Paul
[2014-09-10 16:13:29] - I've been tryign to ignore this whole thing, mostly, but it keeps coming up: http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Hollywood/2014/09/09/An-open-letter-to-the-video-gaming-community-from-a-self-confessed-right-wing-bastard -- Xpovos
[2014-09-10 15:04:14] - a: The toilet paper thing is spot on, and Gurkie and I definitely get into arguments about who has to choose where we're eating, but I don't think we argue about the rest. -Paul
[2014-09-10 13:01:47] - a: I'm pretty sure I stole the joke from TotalBiscuit. -- Xpovos
[2014-09-10 12:30:29] - Aaron: Having a hard time imaging how that game would work on a tablet. -Paul
[2014-09-10 12:23:07] - Xpovos: Gotcha. The quick game nature is why I have been waiting for it on android tablet. Takes too long to wait for my desktop to boot up for a quick 5 minute game. -Paul
[2014-09-10 10:38:54] - they're not related (i hope), so i'm not sure why i put it into one message. ~a
[2014-09-10 10:38:18] - weird things all couples fight about and the number 1 high school in america offers a real head start ~a
[2014-09-10 10:29:59] - paul: iPad galaxy trucker is coming first too
- aaron[2014-09-10 10:21:49] - ahaha. that's a funny joke now that i understand it.
~a[2014-09-10 10:03:39] - Hearthstone on tablet makes it easy to play while on the "throne". Particularly given the quick game time of Hearthstone, it's been a frequent observation that it's a liklihood for the iPad version. -- Xpovos
[2014-09-09 15:59:00] - Xpovos: Sorry, not sure I get it.
-Paul[2014-09-09 14:23:23] - Paul: Hearthrone? -- Xpovos
[2014-09-09 14:00:05] - Same way it pisses me off that iOS seems to always get apps and games before android. Where is my android hearthstone!? -Paul
[2014-09-09 13:59:32] - I'm going to be so pissed if businesses start falling over themselves to support Apple's NFC payment system. Android phones have had NFC for a while now and there are a number of different systems like Apple Pay already available on android, but for whatever nobody cares until the mighty Apple does it their own way. -Paul
[2014-09-09 12:49:06] - http://reason.com/blog/2014/09/09/emergency-room-usage-is-way-up-in-medica Some more flaws in Obamacare are popping up. -Paul
[2014-09-09 12:42:29] - a: Some places give discounts if you pay in bitcoin, I guess since it's cheaper than CCs for them. -Paul
[2014-09-09 12:42:06] - a: If I felt more confident in my knowledge of bitcoin (and crypto-currencies in general), I would probably be more willing to accept the lack of "insurance" (as you call it), but I feel like my ignorance is too risky right now. Although, I am into the idea of having a couple hundred $ in bitcoin at any given time so I can take advantage of the occasional deal. -Paul
[2014-09-09 12:40:23] - a: Huh, I never knew that. Another reason why a lot of places don't want to take credit cards, I guess. -Paul
[2014-09-09 11:54:35] - we'll get there some day. we're not there yet. in the mean time, i don't hold more than $1k online. the rest is on encrypted paper. ~a
[2014-09-09 11:53:36] - eliminating chargebacks is actually one of the major selling points. and a major detraction is exactly what worries you: don't hold a lot of money in there because a virus could easily steal your money, and it's uninsured, and you can't chargeback it get it back. insurance on money isn't free of course, which is why it's an interesting balancing act in my head. ~a
[2014-09-09 11:48:18] - when somebody steals your credit card, they run up fraudulent charges. it's those fraudulent charges that end up being voided all the way to the retailer. it's called a chargeback and it's pretty lame for merchants and therefore it's pretty lame for consumers that want stuff to be cheaper. ~a
[2014-09-09 11:46:15] - paul: "I thought it was the credit card companies that get left holding the bills, and that would just mean higher interest rates for the poor saps that don't pay off in full every month" nope. i thought so too, but nope. ~a
[2014-09-09 11:03:23] - a: I don't know why it would surprise you that I would want that. I consider myself fairly conservative with my money, and right now credit cards are pretty ridiculously safe compared to bitcoins. -Paul
[2014-09-09 11:02:39] - a: I thought it was the credit card companies that get left holding the bills, and that would just mean higher interest rates for the poor saps that don't pay off in full every month. -Paul
[2014-09-09 10:41:09] - as an aside, that doesn't come for free: you have that now with credit cards, but usually when this happens a seller gets fucked when your money gets stolen. so, sellers have to price it in to everything you buy. yah? ~a
[2014-09-09 10:40:42] - paul: "if my stuff gets stolen, I'm not liable?" oh we're not there yet. give it a few more years, that kind of thing is in the works in some companies. i'm surprised you require that though considering your viewpoints on . . . things. ~a
[2014-09-09 09:28:09] - a: Is bitcoin safe for newbs to use yet? When will I be able to have the same protections with bitcoin that I have with credit cards where if my stuff gets stolen, I'm not liable? -Paul
[2014-09-08 18:08:53] - haha, i took it down yesterday because i figured people were tired of seeing bitcoin graphs. ~a
[2014-09-08 17:23:07] - http://www.cnn.com/2014/09/08/us/atlanta-hawks-sale-bruce-levenson-what-we-know/ Wow, first I had heard of this too. -Paul
[2014-09-08 17:15:21] - a: This is the first I heard of it. So paypal is basically accepting bitcoin now? What happened to my handy bitcoin tracker at the top? Was it slowing down the message board? -Paul
[2014-09-08 17:06:54] - aaron: I don't recall knowing girls like that, but I know what you're getting at. Escalation seems to become a much bigger deal when it's a man on a woman vs any other combination. -Paul
[2014-09-08 17:04:15] - mig: I think it helps big time that Ray Rice had a bad season last year and doesn't qualify as a star like Kobe or even Big Ben does. If it had been Peyton Manning who had hit his wife and knocked her out, I don't think there's a chance he gets released and suspended indefinitely. -Paul
[2014-09-08 16:19:23] - (i know paul seems to be the only one here tracking btc, so sorry for everybody else) wow, @paypal? i'm very surprised to be honest. ~a
[2014-09-08 16:19:05] - paul: i think the correct response is you know, don't date girls who hit you. i don't know. did you ever know girls like this? i remember there were girls in high school who thought it was funny to pinch guys or dig their nails into them and draw blood and it was like, you know. "ha ha! oh you! i'm bleeding. i want to hurt you back but i can't!! that's funny!" - aaron
[2014-09-08 16:16:27] - paul: i know it's kind of a "degrees of escalation" thing, i know he shouldn't knock her out. but in the media's eyes, if he reports it to the police, he's a crybaby. if she assaults him, he's a wimp. if he hits back, he's arrested. girls know this, which is why some of them are so quick to assault guys twice their size, what can they do. - aaron
[2014-09-08 16:12:35] - paul: http://www.tmz.com/2014/09/08/ray-rice-elevator-knockout-fiancee-takes-crushing-punch-video/ here's the video that was posted to TMZ - aaron
[2014-09-08 16:09:41] - paul: I'm not really giving them any credit either. Just saying if there's a Big Ben or Kobe like incident that get swept under the rug (both by the league and public opinion), that's going to be a bit of a wtf. - mig
[2014-09-08 16:08:56] - Aaron: Sure, even better. I actually haven't seen either videos, so I don't know the specifics of hoe "self-defensish" it looked (assuming it can be believed that he felt threatened by his fiance). -Paul
[2014-09-08 15:57:38] - paul: if a guy charges at you in an elevator and you knock him out, i think you're usually covered by some variety of self-defense statute. i don't think it would be a crime. - aaron
[2014-09-08 15:55:54] - mig: Maybe I'm cynical, but I don't give the NFL (or Ravens) much credit for "doing the right thing" or "taking the hard line approach" here. They're doing a CYA PR move based on the emotional reaction to people seeing the video. -Paul
[2014-09-08 15:54:23] - aaron: Yeah, I guess what I'm wondering is if it's "wrong" to have that double-standard. I'm not saying it's okay to go around knocking out women, but that maybe it should be treated the same way as if he hit a smaller weaker GUY.... a crime, but not something worth eternal damnation over. -Paul
[2014-09-08 15:50:13] - Honestly, though, I'm not too opposed to the hard line approach, I'm just wondering if this is just happening because this is the issue du jour, rather than an honest attempt to rout out ugly acts of violence out of the league. - mig
[2014-09-08 15:47:12] - obviously there's a line between pushing a girl away and defending yourself, and cold-cocking her in the face, so i'm not saying ray rice is in the clear here. but some people were mocking the twitter apology where the girl apologized for her role in the incident, while i kind of think yeah, they both did kind of play a role here - aaron
[2014-09-08 15:45:35] - paul: i think people would say, "well, there was a 350 pound running back charging at her in an elevator, of course she's going to defend herself". i think there's often the (sometimes warranted) double-standard where if a girl rushes at you, or if a girl assaults you or hits you, and you're a guy, you should just toughen up and take it because you're a guy - aaron
[2014-09-08 15:44:37] - paul: it would be more black and white to me if she hadn't assaulted him (in the legal sense). if someone gets upset at me and rushes at me, my first instinct is to defend myself or push them away. if the genders were truly reversed, and ray rice charged at her, and she decked him, i don't think people would blame her - aaron
[2014-09-08 15:43:18] - mig: Sure, but I still think that reflects more positively on him than Big Ben's accuser being some random stranger who he appears to have had no interaction with again. -Paul
[2014-09-08 15:37:15] - You can't really say, of she forgave him, therefore everything is fine. - mig
[2014-09-08 15:36:38] - paul: that's a tricky thing though. The insidiousness of domestic abuse is that the abused partner is intimidated into submission. Of course, there's no way to tell unless you are close to the couple. Maybe Rice is a serial abuser, maybe this was just one ugly incident. - mig
[2014-09-08 15:33:38] - mig: Ray Rice seems to be getting crucified mainly on the back of the emotional outrage over his treatment of a woman, even though it was a woman who apparently thought his actions were forgiveable enough to marry him. -Paul
[2014-09-08 15:32:20] - mig: Well, and that's another thing. NFL penalties are all over the place with no rhyme or reason. I think Ben's is a little different, considering there's still a decent chance he was innocent (if I recall, he was never charged with anything and there was no evidence against him other than the word of a drunk woman), but your point is well taken. -Paul
[2014-09-08 15:26:05] - paul: i would like to know why Big Ben is still allowed to play football, given the current reaction I'm seeing. - mig
[2014-09-08 15:24:33] - Because while I agree that it's definitely an ugly episode and everything, a part of me feels like this is an old-school kind of thinking (a man should never hit a woman) that I need to re-evaluate. -Paul
[2014-09-08 15:22:36] - I've got an honest question about the Ray Rice thing for people who think what he did was the most horrible thing ever and also for people who believe in total equality of the sexes. Would your opinion change if the roles were reversed (the woman knocked the man out cold)? -Paul
[2014-09-08 15:17:49] - a: Definitely sad.
-Paul[2014-09-08 13:56:26] - "traffic cops and blinding sunlight can still befuddle the system", yeah haha i didn't even think of traffic cops! i guess in a compromised system, certain things would require user interaction. otherwise the traffic cops would need to be able to instruct the autonomous car what to do somehow. ~a
[2014-09-08 13:56:02] - google’s self-driving car may be further away than you think. aww sad. ~a
[2014-09-08 09:30:20] - Xpovos: Yeah, although I don't think that would be any easier to get unless it was blatantly obvious it was made by a German company. -Paul
[2014-09-05 18:07:11] - Paul: At the risk of giving away the joke, I think it would be a better joke if the game were German-made, like so many of my favorite games are. -- Xpovos
[2014-09-05 16:58:50] - Xpovos: Yeah, I didn't get it at first either, but then I couldn't stop smiling. -Paul
[2014-09-05 15:47:47] - Oh... just got it. -- Xpovos
[2014-09-05 15:47:38] - Paul: I don't get the Cards Against Humanity answer. "7-1"? -- Xpovos
[2014-09-05 15:28:36] - a: I've never used them, especially since I got a smartphone. Just seems a little embarrassing for a company that does technical training to be handing something like this out... -Paul
[2014-09-05 15:11:50] - paul: i'm pretty sure i've never used one of those. not for longer than a few weeks anyways. your work should have instead given you an apk with a calendar address book in it! ~a
[2014-09-05 15:01:00] - http://smile.amazon.com/ship-other-countries-like-Brazil/forum/Fx209LQY89OFTF8/Tx2F9LNUMHD146Y/1/ref=cm_cd_ql_tlc_al?_encoding=UTF8&asin=B004S8F7QM Love the answer to this question... -Paul
[2014-09-05 14:50:46] - So, my work just handed out some sort of odd daily planner / 2015 calendar / address book hybrid thing. An actual physical notebook. Who uses these kinds of things anymore? Has anybody used one in the past decade? -Paul
[2014-09-03 13:16:19] - jennifer lawrence is 24. i'll admit what they are doing is probably not the best; i don't think i'd call them perverts. ~a
[2014-09-03 10:55:03] - bah, bad proofreading, strike the "no way" part. - mig
[2014-09-03 10:50:15] - paul: indeed, the $12k would be better served for cancer research than for whatever these perverts were planning on doing with it otherwise. It just seems sad to me there seems to be no way in the eyes of our society that taking that money means indirectly approving of the bad actions of the men who donated. - mig
[2014-09-03 10:31:44] - mig: If I recall correctly, he declined to, and his reason was that the money was better off being spent advancing his message than back in the hands of the white supremacists, advancing their message. I thought that was a good way of thinking about it. -Paul
[2014-09-03 10:29:52] - mig: I generally tend to stand on the side of money not really being tainted by where it came from. I remember this issue coming up during Ron Paul's campaign, and it was discovered that white supremacists had donated to his campaign and people were calling on him to return the money. -Paul
[2014-09-03 10:00:02] - Though I can understand in situations where donations come with strings attached why one would be leery of who is doing the donating, but that doesn't appear to be the case here. - mig
[2014-09-03 09:58:12] - small, but still it seems rather silly that they would reject the donation. - mig
[2014-09-03 09:56:58] - http://fredrikdeboer.com/2014/09/02/time-for-the-libya-mea-culpas/ "I could go on. I keep score, you guys. Because every time you get these things wrong, people die." -Paul
[2014-09-03 09:56:55] - http://www.mediaite.com/online/cancer-research-foundation-rejects-reddit-donations-made-over-nude-photos/ Do donations have to be "clean" in order for charitable organizations to accept it? I mean, you can think it's good that money was donated and also still think the people donating are really sick and deranged people. Though the donation amount is relatively ...
[2014-09-03 09:41:31] - aaron: i had to level them up, but I didn't need to do any unlocking. They were all there when i started with adventure mode. At level 1, but they were there. - mig
[2014-09-03 08:40:50] - mig: i had to unlock and level up the artisans... and when i was playing in a game with you yesterday, the mystic wasn't there. what makes you think that about the artisans? - aaron
[2014-09-02 15:44:13] - provide a warranty, keep a reserve on all sales to cover potential defects, and in general sell a product that meets certain safety standards? That still represents a significant barrier to entry in the car market, but isn't a beureucratic coimmerce-wall with no purpose. -- Xpovos
[2014-09-02 15:42:20] - E.g. I see no reason for laws requiring vehicles be sold through dealerships. Any reason for such an arangement has been obviated by technology and the dereliction of fiduciary responsibility by the dealership. But does that mean the car business has to be wide-open? Couldn't the government write a law, reasonably for a capitalist, that sellers of vehicles must ...
[2014-09-02 15:40:12] - Hmm. As much as I'd love to go down that path, I probably need to retreat. I'm not an anarcho-capitalist. So the next question is, am I being logically consistent? Is it possible to be pro-capitalism in all cases without treading into anarcho-capitalist territory? -- Xpovos
[2014-09-02 15:24:30] - xpovos: sure it has, look at somalia, AMIRITE? - mig
[2014-09-02 15:19:56] - I read articles like this and it just adds fuel to the fire, in my mind, for the argument that free-market capitalism hasn't been tried and found wanting; it hasn't been tried. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-08-29/tesla-fight-erupts-in-georgia-as-dealers-seek-sales-ban.html -- Xpovos
[2014-09-02 14:33:03] - aaron: yeah it's weird. Seasons are supposed to be sort of like playing on a fresh new account, but there apparently is some carryover. You don't have to unlock the aritsans again either, technically. - mig
[2014-09-02 12:36:10] - The quests should give some decent xp and might make it less of a grind--though that would be more compelling if the story were better. I mean even D2 level good, which wasn't amazing. -- Xpovos
[2014-09-02 12:03:38] - mig: personally i played through the story once, alternating between master and T1 as my gear fluctuated. that took me to about level 67, and i got to 70 using rifts and bounties. honestly i didn't realize you could play adventure mode without beating the game, which is why i did it that way - aaron
[2014-09-02 11:39:12] - hah, so a reddit feed that (i'm sure you can guess which one) i read on a regular basis, just had a post about soylent ~a
[2014-09-02 11:30:25] - -Paul
[2014-09-02 11:30:22] - a: It's possible my stance on things have changed a bit with time, too. I feel like I don't have nearly as much time for eating these days as I used to, so the idea of being able to have a quick (and more importantly, not terribly unhealthy) meal every once in awhile is appealing to me.
[2014-09-02 11:22:15] - yeah, i remember the conversation very well, but i may have the details incorrect. i'm not sure which things you said and which things vinnie said, but i do remember it was in the apt you shared with vinnie and both of you were there collectively saying these things. ~a
[2014-09-02 11:20:35] - a: I don't remember this discussion (but it sounds like something that might've happened). I'm definitely not looking to completely replace eating entirely (because I DO love to eat), but it's more looking to replace the meals where I eat crap because I need to eat something and only have 5 minutes. -Paul
[2014-09-02 11:16:21] - (adrian) yeah i guess you're right, eating is awesome and it's the best part of my day too. ok, so i want to be able to get rid of the need to sleep. (paul and vinnie) yeah, needing to sleep is lame. ~a
[2014-09-02 11:15:36] - it's interesting because i feel you and i (and vinnie) had a similar discussion ~2003. the discussion went like this: (adrian) i want to be able to get rid of the need to eat. (paul and vinnie) eating is awesome and i love eating. it's basically the best part of my day. ~a
[2014-09-02 11:12:01] - uh, paul, soylent green is people. ~a
[2014-09-02 10:51:01] - http://www.soylent.me/ I'm thinking of giving this a try. I figure it can't be any worse than the fast food breakfasts that I sometimes feel like I am "forced" to eat due to being in a rush in the morning. Wonder if anybody here has any thoughts. -Paul
[2014-09-02 10:27:14] - aaron: what was more efficient for levelling, playing through the story once or going straight into bounties: I chose the latter but am unsure I made the right call. - mig
[2014-09-02 09:56:59] - upvote. ~a
[2014-09-02 09:46:55] - http://imgur.com/kYCaCqV "If a Penguin were to Eat You, this is the last thing You would see." -Paul
[2014-08-31 09:47:07] - 🈵❌🉑🉐🚻🚯💌🚢🚡⛵🚉🚵🚞🚜🚓🚌
[2014-08-29 12:37:07] - mig: Exciting. Sadly I'm not sure if it's something I'll really be able to partake in. Still a huge fan of the game and series--but life marches on. -- Xpovos
[2014-08-29 11:53:30] - http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/14058735855 diablo 3's first ladder season starts tonight at 9 pm our time. - mig
[2014-08-29 09:01:59] - mig: i know vinnie's played hearthstone, but i don't have his battle.net tag - aaron
[2014-08-28 14:43:13] - http://reason.com/blog/2014/08/28/guess-which-party-says-rand-paul-blames this strikes me as completely sad if this is how democrats are going to act if Clinton is indeed nominated. - mig
[2014-08-28 13:30:02] - http://www.ign.com/articles/2014/08/28/the-underworld-franchise-is-being-rebooted No idea why they would do this. I know I'm probably the only person here who likes these movies, but I feel like the franchise without Kate Beckinsale or Bill Nighy or Micheal Sheen just isn't the same. -Paul
[2014-08-28 01:04:53] - is vinlarad a battle.net tag of anyone we know? I'm trying to figure out if it's vinnie or just some rager who wanted to add me after a hearthstone game. - mig
[2014-08-27 22:57:18] - aaron: See previous comments about bad use of Excel. Golden legendaries are less common than golden commons. You'll get about 64 commons for every legendary. About 13 golden commons for every golden legendary. IF these numbers are both legitimate and a satisfactorily random sample. -- Xpovos
[2014-08-27 18:14:56] - http://assets.makers.com/field/image/Unknown.png playboy - when is a catcall okay? - aaron
[2014-08-27 16:25:01] - xpovos: yeah the golden epic and golden legendary percentages are crazy.... golden legendaries are more common than golden commons?? golden epics are more common than epics?? at first i thought maybe it was because of like, guaranteed legendaries like murkeye but they just messed up the percentages really bad - aaron
[2014-08-27 15:59:17] - also, the author seems to hate tesla for some reason. ~a
[2014-08-27 15:59:03] - "at least unlike Snapchat, which still has zero revenue, there actually are idiots who will pay a premium to subscribe to hemp diapers, and the company does in fact have some revenue" two ridiculous future IPOs. ~a
[2014-08-27 15:06:40] - xpovos: haha, yeah it's sad they don't even have a handle on the simple spreadsheet things: sum, and divided by. maybe they imported the data from a csv? ~a
[2014-08-27 14:19:36] - xpovos: yeah i just realized i added a 0 there. - mig
[2014-08-27 12:37:07] - mig: I'm not sure I can trust the results of someone who can't handle basic Excel functionality. The numbers are on par with what I've seen. Also, that's 11K packs or so. Not 100K. -- Xpovos
[2014-08-27 09:38:05] - https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1FHshgMwxvXUVt05FWfZpjaQmlKISCYIUsPxB_V4mW5U/edit#gid=0 rarity distribution for 100k+ hearthstone packs as a sample size. - mig
[2014-08-26 17:52:41] - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yAzS7j1cf1Q combat juggling? this is a sport? - aaron
[2014-08-26 16:37:41] - a: http://www.reddit.com/r/programming - aaron
[2014-08-26 14:45:17] - aaron: wow. very cool. where did you find that? ~a
[2014-08-26 14:36:16] - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xP5-iIeKXE8 conway's game of life in conway's game of life - aaron
[2014-08-26 14:25:37] - a: Well, that's why I put it in quotes. I'm assuming, though, that you would consider it not being effective (at least) in cases like with Microsoft. -Paul
[2014-08-26 14:20:56] - paul: charges were dropped == failure? i'm not sure i agree. i'm not sure that a case even has to come to court for a law to be useful. if i make murder illegal, and nobody murders anybody, then my law is a failure? ~a
[2014-08-26 13:58:53] - Paul: It was used to make more telephone companies. Though whether that was good or not I don't know since it was awhile ago. -Daniel
[2014-08-26 13:19:17] - a: Heck, I'm having a hard time coming up with good examples of just where it was successfully used.
-Paul[2014-08-26 13:18:55] - a: I'm not knowledgeable enough to think of any examples where it was successfully used AND clearly improved people's lives as well. -Paul
[2014-08-26 13:18:30] - a: I guess I'm having trouble finding examples of where the law was used successfully to help improve people's lives. Some of those links didn't even mention anti-trust stuff, and others were about how it "failed" (charges were dropped). -Paul
prev <-> next