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[2001-04-19 17:09:00] - shift-d, grrr

[2001-04-19 17:05:00] - the professor is great -- the TA is going to be really cool too (:-D)! -jdb

[2001-04-19 17:00:00] - um, no. it's a 3000-level idst course. the class you're thinking of (that was talked about amongst polanah protests) would be implemented through housing program most likely. -jdb

[2001-04-19 16:59:00] - is "diversity and education" the class they're trying to make mandatory? - mig

[2001-04-19 16:56:00] - "diversity and education" is being offered next fall... -jdb

[2001-04-19 16:56:00] - not that crap, stuff like "diversity and education," and... "philosophy and african-american thought." :-D -jdb

[2001-04-19 16:55:00] - we'll see how knowledge and reality works out next semester. - mig

[2001-04-19 16:55:00] - i suppose, i woulnd't have a problem with it if the tests were actually worth something. - mig

[2001-04-19 16:53:00] - hmm, i think ya'll would love some of the classes i'm in -- i talk about this stuff all the time in class. -jdb

[2001-04-19 16:53:00] - p.s. from the school administration point-of-view, these tests are essential -- especially for a big university like us. -jdb

[2001-04-19 16:52:00] - you could be dumb and do well, you could be smart and not do well.  it's more of "how you take" the test rather than what you know. - mig

[2001-04-19 16:51:00] - meh.  i don't think the sat is an accurate measure of how bright you are.  it's more a problem with how the test is rather than the fact it's used for admission. - mig

[2001-04-19 16:51:00] - how do you feel about standardized testing scores being used for admission? -jdb

[2001-04-19 16:50:00] - ok here's the sentance: according to him, business would ideally pick those who are qualified.  i'm not naive enough to think that most people do not take race into consideration when hiring. - mig

[2001-04-19 16:49:00] - true it probably gave me some more brownie points, but going to tj gave me a lot more brownie points. - mig

[2001-04-19 16:49:00] - just restate the whole sentence , you're confusing me, hehe. -jdb

[2001-04-19 16:48:00] - actually, i don't think race ever came into it.  it might have been small, but it was more of me going to tj that got me into tech. - mig

[2001-04-19 16:48:00] - god dammit, i'm really horrible at typing today: do = do not - mig

[2001-04-19 16:47:00] - how do you feel about vt giving you special consideration? -jdb

[2001-04-19 16:47:00] - whoops, insert "naive enough to think"

[2001-04-19 16:46:00] - according to him, business would ideally pick those who are qualified.  i'm not naive enough that most people do take race into consideration when hiring. - mig

[2001-04-19 16:45:00] - hmmm.... i'm kind of agree with it.  i can see the logic of the paul's arguments against them, but i don't agree with him. - mg

[2001-04-19 16:43:00] - but this reparation thing isn't about acknowledgement, this is about holding people responsible who are not responsible for the mistakes of the past. - mig

[2001-04-19 16:42:00] - mig: how do you feel about affirmative action? as a minority, i'm sure you've experienced it at some point? -jdb

[2001-04-19 16:42:00] - bickering and arguing about the past is not good. acknowledgement of the past is key. -jdb

[2001-04-19 16:39:00] - i'm also acknowledge that we do have a very long way to go.  but bickering and arguing about that past solves nothing.  looking towards the future and learning from the mistakes of the past is the only way to solve any problem. - mig

[2001-04-19 16:38:00] - admitting we have major-major-major racial problems in our society -- that we aren't dealing with "opening up old wounds" ... we're dealing with wounds that have been open for over 100 years. -jdb

[2001-04-19 16:36:00] - i don't see how taking away money from every single non-black person and giving it to every single black person is the best way of "dealing with it."- mig

[2001-04-19 16:36:00] - (but for entirely different reasons...) -jdb

[2001-04-19 16:36:00] - (reminder: i'm against reparations also :-P ) -jdb

[2001-04-19 16:35:00] - and reparations is an appropiate way of "dealing with it"? Don't we have stuff like affirmitive action, that are supposed to reduce racism? - mig

[2001-04-19 16:33:00] - i don't think "letting things go" is the answer. dealing with them is the answer. we obviously have a long way to go. -jdb

[2001-04-19 16:27:00] - all the demanding for reparations now just causes the ugly wounds of the past to be opened again. - mig

[2001-04-19 16:26:00] - go? - mig

[2001-04-19 16:26:00] - i know you're trying to point out, but the whole black reparation is no the same thing.  those responsible for slavery are dead.  those that were directly involved with slavery are dead?  yes, it was an ugly part of u.s. history.  why can't we let it

[2001-04-19 16:25:00] - mig: i really have no idea. -jdb

[2001-04-19 16:22:00] - http://www.asianweek.com/2000_05_25/news_jlareparationsplan.html -jdb

[2001-04-19 16:18:00] - are they paying these reparations now? - mig

[2001-04-19 16:17:00] - http://www.ushmm.org/assets/frg.htm -jdb

[2001-04-19 16:16:00] - http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/Holocaust/reparations.html -jdb

[2001-04-19 16:15:00] - we don't demand reparations to germany today for what hitler did 50 years ago either. - mig

[2001-04-19 16:11:00] - correct, we don't "continually harass" germany for what hitler did, but we also don't condemn it, or sweep it under the rug. -jdb

[2001-04-19 16:08:00] - http://www.newscientist.com/newsletter/features.jsp?id=ns22871 -jdb

[2001-04-19 16:03:00] - well i figured, since it's supposadly the real deal this time. - mig

[2001-04-19 16:02:00] - p.s. the new radiohead album is cool. -jdb

[2001-04-19 16:02:00] - if this was done 100 or so years ago, it would be different.  those that wronged and those that were wronged were still alive.  - mig

[2001-04-19 16:00:00] - do we continually harass germany for what hitler did?  no.  - mig

[2001-04-19 15:59:00] - it's not about apathy.  it's about leaving the past in the past. - mig

[2001-04-19 15:58:00] - is whining about something that happened in the past and not letting it go a good thing? - mig

[2001-04-19 15:57:00] - is apathy a good thing? -jdb

[2001-04-19 15:37:00] - another problem with reparations:  what about us hispanics?  we've been oppressed, and almost had it as hard as the black people?  you don't see us whining to spain or portugal about reparations for enslaving our people and pillaging our lands. - mig

[2001-04-19 15:24:00] - http://www.lp.org/lpnews/0105/parker.html -paul

[2001-04-19 15:17:00] - I saw a person with a "soy milk?" t-shirt and he gave me a flyer promoting their "murder king" protest -paul

[2001-04-19 14:35:00] - http://calendar.vt.edu/details.phtml?eventid=7185 <-- greenpeace speaker tonight in squires. -jdb

[2001-04-19 14:23:00] - http://monkeyfist.com:8080/morgue/politics/reparations/case-for -jdb

[2001-04-19 14:22:00] - disturbing --> http://www.boston.com/dailyglobe2/108/metro/A_sad_site_abuse_for_sale+.shtml -jdb

[2001-04-19 14:20:00] - heat sensitive house paint --> http://www.newscientist.com/newsletter/news.jsp?id=ns228741 -jdb

[2001-04-19 14:03:00] - http://www.illegalvoices.org/ruckus/ <-- another neat anarchist collective. -jdb

[2001-04-19 14:03:00] - http://www.au.org/press/pr41701.htm -jdb

[2001-04-19 14:01:00] - http://www.massmic.com/ <-- good mailing list i'm on. -jdb

[2001-04-19 12:48:00] - new word: uuuuuuuuugly :-P - boing

[2001-04-19 12:47:00] - I have to say, the color it turns the background and everything when miguel is at the forefront is uuuuuuuuugly - boing

[2001-04-19 12:46:00] - and they've been gradually adding things like file transfers and online game connections that ICQ had all along - boing

[2001-04-19 12:45:00] - and aim didn't have anything but messaging and buddy chat until aol realized that instant messaging was a growing market, and bought mirabilis (icq)

[2001-04-19 12:44:00] - I really didn't think icq was all that usable - boing

[2001-04-19 12:44:00] - judging from what happened with aim, though, usability in an instant messenger client comes after it is accepted - boing

[2001-04-19 12:05:00] - ya'll would probably enjoy my persuasion class. the professor is about as right wing as it gets on this campus. -jdb

[2001-04-19 11:59:00] - sex

[2001-04-19 11:58:00] - the video was primarily concerned with resource depletion. -jdb

[2001-04-19 11:53:00] - What kind of problems does our consumer culture have? -paul

[2001-04-19 11:41:00] - we just watched one in persuasion class -- eloquently described some of the problems of of our consumer culture. :-P -jdb

[2001-04-19 11:32:00] - whoops, stupid enter key.  anyway his videos seem rather pricey. - mig

[2001-04-19 11:32:00] - sut hally

[2001-04-19 11:25:00] - http://community.borland.com/article/0,1410,20792,00.html -jdb

[2001-04-19 11:06:00] - http://www.collegiatetimes.com/ctonline/article.php3?387000 -jdb

[2001-04-19 10:52:00] - Sut Jhally (http://www.sutjhally.com/) rules. -jdb

[2001-04-19 07:19:00] - yep, jabber is neat stuff -- i used to have it set up a year or so ago, but found that it wasn't quite as usable as aim/icq. -jdb

[2001-04-19 02:07:00] - if anyone joins it, message me at "Boing" - boing

[2001-04-19 01:57:00] - maybe if we all start using it, it'll spread :-P - boing

[2001-04-19 01:57:00] - expandable IM client, based on an open protocol - boing

[2001-04-19 01:56:00] - http://www.jabber.com/ - boing

[2001-04-19 01:42:00] - haha.  i thought that was funny. - mig

[2001-04-19 01:41:00] - watching MTV or M2. It's disgusting." wes borland - mig

[2001-04-19 01:41:00] - ""I feel partially responsible. We've influenced a lot of                                          bands that I think are terrible. It's just like, c'mon... inkin Park? Crazy Town? I just want to stab my eyeball out with a screwdriver. I've completel

[2001-04-18 23:42:00] - http://washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A33571-2001Apr18.html -paul

[2001-04-18 22:12:00] - That sucks, we need all the freedom sites we can get -paul

[2001-04-18 22:10:00] - either way i don't know what happened. - mig

[2001-04-18 22:09:00] - they didn't shut down, they just stopped updating. - mig

[2001-04-18 21:58:00] - Why did they shut down? -paul

[2001-04-18 21:47:00] - esp since it was one of the sites which actually got me interested in the issue of free speech. - mig

[2001-04-18 21:42:00] - it's a shame they don't update anymore, it was such a great site. - mig

[2001-04-18 21:41:00] - though it's still pretty old. - mig

[2001-04-18 21:41:00] - http://www.theroc.org/roc-news/roc-news.htm  here's some more recent stuff. - mig

[2001-04-18 21:39:00] - http://www.theroc.org/updates/mansont2.htm  this one's actually scary. - mig

[2001-04-18 21:31:00] - yay, republicans!

[2001-04-18 21:29:00] - http://www.theroc.org/updates/incident.htm  go to school censorship and read all the insanity!  - mig

[2001-04-18 21:27:00] - Ah, yes. Distributing drugs is bad :-) -paul

[2001-04-18 21:24:00] - http://www.theroc.org/updates/asthma.htm ah... here's the one that takes the cake. - mig

[2001-04-18 21:21:00] - http://www.theroc.org/updates/ca-hugs.htm this one comes close - mig

[2001-04-18 21:15:00] - oh hold on.  i think i do know something more crazy. - mig

[2001-04-18 21:14:00] - buss = bus :-[ -paul

[2001-04-18 21:13:00] - I think so, because all this student was trying to do was to communicate, so she was being suspended for talking on the buss essentially -paul

[2001-04-18 21:10:00] - lamer than being suspended for pointing fingers at another student. - mig

[2001-04-18 21:08:00] - I dunno, I think getting suspended for sign language is pretty lame -paul

[2001-04-18 21:02:00] - haven't topped the finger pointing incident though. - mig

[2001-04-18 21:00:00] - it's a competition i tells ya.  school admininstrators are in a stupidity contest to see how who can make the dumbest regulations. - mig

[2001-04-18 20:59:00] - Who knows? Probably some obscure law prohibiting sign language because it is satanic or something -paul

[2001-04-18 20:58:00] - paul: i wonder how it was a safety problem? -jdb

[2001-04-18 20:55:00] - http://www.salon.com/people/wire/2001/04/18/lesko/index.html -paul

[2001-04-18 20:47:00] - how am i doing that?  i'm not saying slavery never happened, i'm just saying that a small portion of the population participated in it in the civil war. - mig

[2001-04-18 20:45:00] - mig: we seem to be arguing very different issues. i hope you aren't insinuating that slavery was some sort of mass delusion. -jdb

[2001-04-18 20:44:00] - the logic of reparations is that if you are black, you get money, how is that not a free govrenment handout. - mig

[2001-04-18 20:44:00] - not only that, only 10% of the people in the south during the civil war owned slavees. making all non-blacks pay for something a small percentage of all non-blacks did is grossly unfair. - mig

[2001-04-18 20:43:00] - yes, but the japanese who were paid were actually wronged by the us government. - mig

[2001-04-18 20:42:00] - Right, because there were identifiable victims that we could pay, I don't think there are any living ex-slaves in America right now -paul

[2001-04-18 20:41:00] - (well, the law for the reparations was passed in `88) -jdb

[2001-04-18 20:40:00] - back in 1988, we paid reparations to japanese-americans detained during ww2. -jdb

[2001-04-18 20:39:00] - Well, giving out reparations now would essentially be free government handouts -paul

[2001-04-18 20:38:00] - I have a hard time with reparations myself because quite frankly, a libertarian government should never have a problem with having to pay reparations -paul

[2001-04-18 20:38:00] - that is why i get extremely irked to see comments like reparations being referred to as "free government handouts." -jdb

[2001-04-18 20:36:00] - i would be the first to say it's impractical to pay reparations -- but that doesn't mean that i  think they're "wrong" on other reasons. we've paid reparations to other groups, we've forced other nations to pay reparations, but we neglected our own.

[2001-04-18 20:36:00] - I mean, the US government has done a lot of crappy things in the past to a lot of people. Should be give out reparations to everyone who has been a victim of injustice? -paul

[2001-04-18 20:35:00] - The problem I have with reparations is twofold. Who pays it and who gets it? -paul

[2001-04-18 20:34:00] - But does that past injustice, which involved long dead people, involve us?  You could argue that we inherited the injustices (i.e., wealth obtained unjustly, passed down through inheritence), but I think that's a shaky argument. -logan

[2001-04-18 20:30:00] - mig: reparations aren't "free government" handouts. the government said it would do something, that it never followed through on. -jdb

[2001-04-18 20:29:00] - see, if the U.S. had just followed through with reparations at the end of slavery, this would not be much of an issue. -jdb

[2001-04-18 20:17:00] - and the us government will be dicking a hell of a lot more people if reparations is ever passed. - mig

[2001-04-18 20:12:00] - and i also believe mlk and x would never demand "reparations", they wanted equality, not free government handouts. - mig

[2001-04-18 20:11:00] - reparations being one of them.  - mig

[2001-04-18 20:11:00] - as for blacks wanting superiority.  i guess that was exagerrating a little.  some vocal black leaders do want "special priveleges" for all blacks that they don't necessarily deserve. - mig

[2001-04-18 20:10:00] - josh:  i'm against reparations because they would be grossly unfair to everyone in the united states, and it's very racist. - mig

[2001-04-18 19:58:00] - a: i use amazon as an information source. i prefer to support small local bookstores and online sellers such as powell's. but they don't have extensive information sources like cover images, reviews by lots of folks, etc. -jdb

[2001-04-18 19:50:00] - http://members.nbci.com/ccadp/serialpresident.htm -logan

[2001-04-18 19:44:00] - jdb: amazon is bad (http://www.noamazon.com/)  ~a

[2001-04-18 19:37:00] - http://www.asfar.org/zine/6th/guest1.html -logan

[2001-04-18 19:00:00] - http://www.vtu.org/4-23-01.htm :-D -jdb

[2001-04-18 18:32:00] - Sure.  But it's the government programs that are the problem, not the talking about it. -logan

[2001-04-18 18:25:00] - see, i think a part of making it disappear and becoming irrelevant isn't ignoring it... it's talking about... working things out, etc. -jdb

[2001-04-18 18:15:00] - Yes, my second sentence would require a lot of discussion of math, philosophy, and justice in order to justify it. :P -logan

[2001-04-18 18:14:00] - It's like we're bickering over which sort of racism we want to have, instead of actually making it disappear or become irrelevant. -logan

[2001-04-18 18:13:00] - Hate crime legislation and affirmative action accord special rights and priveleges to people based solely on their race or heritage -- this is just racism of another form. -logan

[2001-04-18 18:13:00] - i agree with your first sentence. :-P -jdb

[2001-04-18 18:12:00] - I'm against reparations because it is impossible to determine who deserves to pay and who deserves to receive.  I think that society and the universe is so complex that most of the time we end up with what we deserve anyway. -logan

[2001-04-18 18:07:00] - logan: maybe things like "hate crime legislation, changing state flags, affirmative action, and so forth" don't perpetuate racism -- they just bring it to the surface (it's just below it, i think). they perpetuate awareness. -jdb

[2001-04-18 18:05:00] - nearly all the black history month talks i attended were about apathy in the black community and in college students in general also. -jdb

[2001-04-18 18:04:00] - i find our campus to be terribly apathetic. this is one of the reasons i scoff when people talk about how this place is so liberal. -jdb

[2001-04-18 18:03:00] - mig: malcolm x and mjk jr. would probably be sick... because of the general sense of apathy. read "race matters" by cornel west (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0679749861/). -jdb

[2001-04-18 18:01:00] - i'm only against reparations because they would be impractical to implement. i think we (the us gov't) dicked over a lot of people. -jdb

[2001-04-18 18:00:00] - it is all about the assimilation argument (that can be used against everthing, pretty much) -jdb

[2001-04-18 17:59:00] - mig: you'd love a book i just read -- "hunger of memory" by richard rodriguez (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0553272934/). -jdb

[2001-04-18 17:57:00] - i was speaking a black tech alum today that told me when he here in 86, Va started recognizing mlk jr. day. the KKK protested in front of the memorial chapel. The university president (mccomas at the time?, maybe) asked them to leave. -jdb

[2001-04-18 17:54:00] - mig: woah... "blacks want superiority" <--- that's a pretty hefty claim to make! -jdb

[2001-04-18 17:54:00] - I don't believe in race, so I can get away with saying anything and still not be a racist. (; -logan

[2001-04-18 17:53:00] - I think things like hate crime legislation, changing state flags, affirmative action, and so forth, actually act to perpetuate racism. -logan

[2001-04-18 17:53:00] - but i don't see very many people speaking out against stuff like reparations, and everyone who doesn't side with the blacks on both issues gets labeled as a racist. - mig

[2001-04-18 17:52:00] - dinner time!  yay!  dietrick at 6 if you care.  bye.  -  aba

[2001-04-18 17:52:00] - I see a lot of blacks that are a little too quick to point out problems that don't exist at all, in order to satisfy their own personal agenda, and that just creates more racial tension. Just look at VT. :P -logan

[2001-04-18 17:52:00] - i guess that's true. - mig

[2001-04-18 17:51:00] - yes, but as you said before.  you can't let 10% of the population be representative of the whole.  *shrug*  -  aba

[2001-04-18 17:51:00] - People do speak a bit of some form of racism or prejudice towards "hicks" (particularly anyone that speaks with a strong accent). -logan

[2001-04-18 17:51:00] - it's probably not a lot of blacks who want reparations.  it's more likely the few vocal ones.  and i think a lot of nonblacks are against the use of the confederate flag as well.  -  aba

[2001-04-18 17:50:00] - if malcom x or mlk were still alive today, they would be disgusted as to how some black leaders act today. - mig

[2001-04-18 17:50:00] - not really.  i think they want equality.  they're just not quite ready to accept it yet as a whole.  -  aba

[2001-04-18 17:50:00] - which is why a lot of them are for things like removing the confederate flag, and slavery reparations. - mig

[2001-04-18 17:49:00] - which is the problem in our country.  blacks don't want equailty. they want superiority.  - mig

[2001-04-18 17:49:00] - i think i'm a bit of a weird case because i sometimes consider myself indian and sometimes i consider myself american.  i think people like me are coming about more and more in today's society.  -  aba

[2001-04-18 17:48:00] - i think that's a little untrue.  i think most people feel it's ok to make fun of something that is part of your own culture.  indians make fun of indians.  americans make fun of americans.  yet blacks distance themselves from america.  -  aba

[2001-04-18 17:46:00] - And as far as race is a culturally thing (I don't buy race as a genetic thing -- I think that's just plain dumb), hicks are indeed a race. -logan

[2001-04-18 17:46:00] - they're still considered a group of people.  true you wouldn't be considered a racist if you hated hicks, but you'd still be prejudiced. - mig

[2001-04-18 17:46:00] - Or, rather, why is it so trendy to be so "tolerant" and "respectful" of "diversity" and other cultures, as long as the culture isn't American (particularly Southern)? -logan

[2001-04-18 17:45:00] - because hicks aren't a race?  -  aba

[2001-04-18 17:44:00] - that's the other thing i can't get.  why is it acceptable to make fun of hicks while you're considered racist if you make fun of blacks? - mig

[2001-04-18 17:44:00] - That show was equivalent to what Pokemon or whatever is today, back when I was a kid (at least in Pulaski County). -logan

[2001-04-18 17:43:00] - sorry . . . .  :[  -  aba

[2001-04-18 17:42:00] - Hicks?!  You racist! :P -logan

[2001-04-18 17:40:00] - we got knots landing briefly on egyptian television.  now if you live there and get cable, you get all the stuff like nbc abc and fox and all.  -  aba

[2001-04-18 17:39:00] - um, logan, that looks like a very messed up show.  hicks never seemed very attractive to me . . .    :p  -  aba

[2001-04-18 17:39:00] - I doubt Dukes of Hazzard would ever be a big Egyptian thing. *grin* -logan

[2001-04-18 17:38:00] - it may be unfair, but that is what has happened.  i am sure most germans in nazi germany would not have condoned a lot of the stuff that hitler did.  i dunno.  things don't always turn out the way we want them to.  -  aba

[2001-04-18 17:37:00] - Hehe, this is the first link google showed (this guy is pretty obsessed) - http://www.smartlink.net/~dstitz/Dukes_of_Hazzard/Hazzard.html -logan

[2001-04-18 17:37:00] - i do think it's unfair to judge a symbol based on what 10% of it's population did. - mig

[2001-04-18 17:36:00] - we didn't get much english television in egypt in the 80s.  during the gulf war, cnn broadcast for free and that was a huge deal.  -  aba

[2001-04-18 17:35:00] - i don't know.  i don't watch tv much.  i usually watch comedy central fox or vh1.  -  aba

[2001-04-18 17:35:00] - Take rural southern culture and make a tv show out of it. And throw in some car stunts.  I loved that show as a kid. :P -logan

[2001-04-18 17:34:00] - Heh, apparently coming on at 2am on TNN (if you get that on campus). -logan

[2001-04-18 17:34:00] - i didn't move here until 1990.  i missed a lot.  -  aba

[2001-04-18 17:33:00] - The best TV show of the 80s.  I wonder if they still show it on TNN. -logan

[2001-04-18 17:32:00] - what is the dukes of hazzard?  :[  -  aba

[2001-04-18 17:32:00] - I think it is a grave thing when symbols become taboo. -logan

[2001-04-18 17:30:00] - I don't know about you, but when I see the Confederate flag, I think of the Dukes of Hazzard, and that gives me a warm, fuzzy feeling inside. -logan

[2001-04-18 17:27:00] - no one will ever talk about what horrible economic conditions germany was in before hitler came around.  sure the germans made a bad decision in hitler, but when all you see is bad choices, you pick the one you think will be the best.  :-\  -  aba

[2001-04-18 17:24:00] - it's just like how most people see a swastika and think of the nazis.  the swastika was an ancient indian symbol of good luck.  my mom has jewelry that has been passed through our family with swastikas though usually she won't wear them.  -  aba

[2001-04-18 17:22:00] - i think the problem that most people have with the flag is not the confederacy or what it stood for, but what the flag represents today.  most people see a confederate flag and think of slave owners.  -  aba

[2001-04-18 16:53:00] - anyways, stabbing westward is playing at hfs this year!  my faith in hfs has been restored!. - mig

[2001-04-18 16:52:00] - I've found that the best way to communicate with him is to agree with everything he says and never give your opinion around him, because if it differs from his, it is wrong -paul

[2001-04-18 16:50:00] - I wouldn't bother arguing with Aaron, Miguel. To him, he is right and anyone who doesn't agree with him is illogical and stupid -paul

[2001-04-18 16:38:00] - http://www.collegiatetimes.com/ctonline/article.php3?253012 i like this one too. - mig

[2001-04-18 16:34:00] - heritage or hate article brings up a lot of good points. - mig

[2001-04-18 16:25:00] - http://www.collegiatetimes.com/ctonline/both.php3 <-- put "confederate" in the headline search field. -jdb

[2001-04-18 16:18:00] - aye.  some of the people who responded to it did so intelligently. - mig

[2001-04-18 16:16:00] - "The flag is not the problem. The people that are making a big deal out of it are the problem."    says an african american  ~a

[2001-04-18 16:09:00] - http://cagle.slate.msn.com/news/flag/ -jdb

[2001-04-18 16:08:00] - http://www.britannica.com/magazine/print?ebsco_id=319183 -jdb

[2001-04-18 15:40:00] - aaron left.  ~a

[2001-04-18 15:39:00] - and again, this whole issue of the confederate flag is just abusing the "race card" again.  the "side with the blacks or you're a racist" mentality realy makes me sick. - mig

[2001-04-18 15:37:00] - as for the swastika, the part of history is definitely known, so i understand why people are offended. - mig

[2001-04-18 15:36:00] - you could ask paul as well, he took hist of the civil war i think last semester. - mig

[2001-04-18 15:34:00] - and i'm not saying slavery wasn't evil.  it is evil.  the civil war would have happened even if there was no slavery. - mig

[2001-04-18 15:32:00] - s/d in 11th said the civil war had little to do with slavery.  so i got at least 1 hist teacher backing me up. - mig

[2001-04-18 15:31:00] - the other thing was that not even that many people in the south even owned slaves.  it was like 10% of all the white population owned slaves. - mig

[2001-04-18 15:30:00] - Other than that, I don't know. You could be right, you could be wrong. Right now it's your word against a couple of teachers I have had previously so I don't really know. - aaron

[2001-04-18 15:30:00] - i don't think miguel is saying slavery isn't evil  ~a

[2001-04-18 15:29:00] - Nobody said they were evil, there are obvious economical advantages to having slaves, particularly when trying to farm - aaron

[2001-04-18 15:28:00] - so as such i do believe anyone who believes that the confederate flag stands for slavery or racism is ignorant. - mig

[2001-04-18 15:27:00] - i'd also like to point out that i don't believe the south was any more right than the north.  it just wasn't as simple as the union were the "great heroes" and the south were the "evil slaveholders". - mig

[2001-04-18 15:25:00] - which was the point of the emancipation proclamation  ~a

[2001-04-18 15:25:00] - the fact that slavery was accepted in the south was something the union exploited to keep european nations from supporting the confederacy. - mgi

[2001-04-18 15:24:00] - they really can't lie regarding english, math, or science.  ~a

[2001-04-18 15:24:00] - that is why 5th grade history sucks.  they oversimplify things (or just plain lie)  ~a

[2001-04-18 15:23:00] - there were also southern leaders who were pushing to end slavery so they could get support from european nations. - mig

[2001-04-18 15:23:00] - the civil war had more to do with economics and vast cultural differences within the south and the north(state's rights vs. strong central government). - mig

[2001-04-18 15:21:00] - I thought the south was refusing to comply with anti-slavery laws or something, so they broke off or something. How do you know slavery was going to end? - aaron

[2001-04-18 15:21:00] - ring statistics:  http://ring.wox.org/stats5.html  ~a

[2001-04-18 15:21:00] - in fact, they didn't free any slaves in any union states until after the war ended(even when lincoln issued the emancipation proclamation). - mig

[2001-04-18 15:19:00] - slavery was going to end regardless of who won the civil war. - mig

[2001-04-18 15:18:00] - those stupid racist hicks :-P  ~a

[2001-04-18 15:18:00] - and as such, the south was "evil". - mig

[2001-04-18 15:18:00] - the reason people get offended by it is because the civil war all about slavery and oppression against blacks, and that the "great heroes" of the north came and put an end to slavery. - mig

[2001-04-18 15:16:00] - my problem with not that people the fact people get offended by the confederate flag, it's why they get offended by it. - mig

[2001-04-18 15:14:00] - So I can't understand from your viewpoint why any other symbols should be viewed as being offensive - aaron

[2001-04-18 15:13:00] - Not an insult, it's just we've already established that you think that violence and profanity are just information to be interpreted, and that they should have no adverse affect on anybody - aaron

[2001-04-18 15:13:00] - hollywood  ~a

[2001-04-18 15:13:00] - hence, the only thing that people really find revolting about the confederate flag was that it supposadly stands for racism and slavery, which is a label i think was unfairly placed upon it. - mig

[2001-04-18 15:12:00] - holywood doesn't seem to think so  ~a

[2001-04-18 15:12:00] - i don't see why so many people believe  the civil war was all about slavery and racism.  it in fact had very little to do with it. - mig

[2001-04-18 15:10:00] - was that an insult? - mig

[2001-04-18 15:07:00] - what's so revolting about the swastika? Or the word, "Fuck", or the middle finger? Some things I think are just beyond your grasp, miguel - aaron

[2001-04-18 15:04:00] - what's so revolting about the confederate flag? - mig

[2001-04-18 14:56:00] - or maybe they just wanted no mosh pits this year. - mig

[2001-04-18 14:48:00] - such a shame i guess hfs has been completely mtvized. - mig

[2001-04-18 14:46:00] - grrr.... the hfstival has gone completely soft this year.  i like live and incubus, but there's not even one hard rock band this year. what the fuck? - mig

[2001-04-18 14:22:00] - who decided on the laws of physics?  how were they decided?  ~a

[2001-04-18 14:22:00] - I ate two free cookies from the Campus Crusade For Chist. And where is that new flag? - aaron

[2001-04-18 14:11:00] - http://www.adobe.com/products/acrobat/readstep2.html

[2001-04-18 14:10:00] - hmmm, just seeing the confederate flag design makes my stomach turn. -jdb

[2001-04-18 14:04:00] - well, in your opinion... i think it looks better!

[2001-04-18 13:12:00] - Geez, the proposed new Mississippi flag is ugly, I'm not surprised they turned it down. -paul

[2001-04-18 13:07:00] - Is Aparna gone so it is safe to post? :-P Is anyone else fed up with all those annoying Campus Crusade for Christ flyers and tables out there? -paul

[2001-04-18 13:06:00] - http://content.health.msn.com/content/article/1728.77512

[2001-04-18 12:53:00] - although i doubt any of you would be interested in that, hehe :-P -jdb

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